The topic at the discussion meeting I went to this morning was acceptance, a subject that I'm really working hard on. Most just shared their experiences with working on it.
But the very last person to speak said life's a joke, a farce, a waste of time and we humans just keep going through it over and over again, day after day. I don't know why we don't all just blow our brains out.
That really threw me I guess I wasn't expecting to hear anything like that and I feel kind of sucker punched. Three hours later I still feel sick in the stomach.
I don't feel judgemental or anything. I have no idea what that man has gone through or is going through. I feel... fragile, I guess, like I wasn't prepared, I wasn't wearing enough armor to handle something so negative at a meeting where we're supposed to working for the common good and supporting each other. I guess I am kind of mad at him for saying that. I mean, really! Couldn't ya just have passed?
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You can't change where you've been, you can only change where you're going
We're all sick people...Some are just sicker than others....When it comes to working the steps...You take them exactly as laid out in the book with direction from your sponsor....When it comes to meetings...You can take what you want and leave the rest....I would have left that.
Glad you are sober and making it to meetings. Yeah, AA is the real deal, nothing staged or rehearsed, you never know what is going to happen. I can understand you being a little shaken by the experience, but God won't give you anything you can't handle.
It's hard to say what the story is with this man...dry drunk at best, mental illness... whatever. Spiritual experience as a result of these steps? Certainly not.
People like this make me grateful God gave me the willingness to recover. One thing for sure, life is not the problem, we must accept the we are the problem otherwise there is no solution.
Acceptlife on life's terms.
Life is just what happens while we're busy making our plans. We can learn something from everyone.
Rob
-- Edited by Rob84 on Monday 16th of July 2012 10:33:53 PM
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Rob
"There ain't no Coupe DeVille hiding in the bottom of a Cracker Jack Box."
Acceptance.... Accepting that what he said can not be unsaid. Accepting that he probably really needed to get that out of his system. It's not personal, what he said. It's business, his business. Maybe that's how he was reaching out for help. Maybe that's his interpretation of "it is what it is and that's how it will be"
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sober: showing no excessive or extreme qualities of fancy, emotion, or prejudice
AA is an exceedingly diverse and unusually colorful collection of people with all kinds of personalities and problems in addition to that of alcoholism. Individual meetings also tend to acquire a special flavor and "personality" of their own. All in all, AA represents a vast cross-section of the general population. Along with the many good people who attend and who are sober are always some who are not so good and who may or may not be sober. An AA saying wryly but accurately notes that "If you like everyone you meet in AA, you haven't been to enough meetings."
Although the natural fear and anxiety of many newcomers usually serves to protect them from premature and unwise involvement with those who may not be good for them, occasionally the newcomer is so desperate for real human contact and even affection that he or she may be vulnerable to exploitation for money, sex or other favors by unscrupulous individuals. "Thirteenth Stepping" there are actually only twelve steps in the Twelve Step program- is the common term for sexual exploitation of female newcomers by males in the program. The reasons to avoid premature emotional and physical intimacy in early recovery are obvious and really come down to just one principal concern: such involvements frequently become unmanageably complex or turn sour, and the risk of alcoholic relapse for the newcomer is extremely high. It is always best to keep one's life as simple and non-stressful as possible in the beginning of recovery.
Sometimes newcomers plunge right into the after-meeting socializing and personal relationships among members at a pace that is too fast for their own good. Non-program related issues and concerns may sometimes dominate these friendships and work to the detriment of the individual's recovery by blurring their focus on the AA program itself. Conflicts and complications in personal friendships with other AA members may even serve to disillusion the newcomer and undermine his trust in the program itself. It is therefore always wise to remember the advice, "Principles before personalities." Individual human beings are always fallible and hence apt to disappoint, but the principles of recovery and of right conduct remain and are untouched by individual failings.
Source..
Your First AA Meeting An Unofficial Guide For the Perplexed Floyd P. Garrett, M.D.
Let no one, and nothing stand in your way Tina. I remember the first time I heard a really really negative person share. It was VERY shocking and I was fragile too... not prepared I guess. I was putting everyone on a pedestal I realized, and we're all just human... all here because we're alcoholics, and that doesn't go away. We ALL need support, the newcomer and the old timer - everyone in between, the good bad and the ugly ; )
I judged every single person in AA as if I was God when I first got here (er um... as if that was a super long time ago LOL) I still do it, but now I take my little poker out of my back pocket and poke myself... still human every time. Ask my HP for help, remind myself where I am (also not in prison or dead at least)... move on.
That person went to a meeting, and reached out. I only hope I can have enough sense to do that when my day comes. It will I'm sure. Never the less, I was JUST where you are, and I remember the sting clearly. Let nothing and no one - stand in your way Tina : ) You can do this!
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Thanks for everything. Peace and Love on your journey.
There were many that troubled me in my early days also. Some died of alcoholism, others just disappeared and some I ended up being their sponsor. The reason why we are in AA is because we are all sick people. I also said some sick things, but as I grew spiritually through working my steps of recovery, I was able to make amends. Many of my critics have become my benefactors.
Let no one, and nothing stand in your way Tina. I remember the first time I heard a really really negative person share. It was VERY shocking and I was fragile too... not prepared I guess. I was putting everyone on a pedestal I realized, and we're all just human... all here because we're alcoholics, and that doesn't go away. We ALL need support, the newcomer and the old timer - everyone in between, the good bad and the ugly ; )
I judged every single person in AA as if I was God when I first got here (er um... as if that was a super long time ago LOL) I still do it, but now I take my little poker out of my back pocket and poke myself... still human every time. Ask my HP for help, remind myself where I am (also not in prison or dead at least)... move on.
That person went to a meeting, and reached out. I only hope I can have enough sense to do that when my day comes. It will I'm sure. Never the less, I was JUST where you are, and I remember the sting clearly. Let nothing and no one - stand in your way Tina : ) You can do this!
I don't think I'm judging. I'm trying not to at any rate because I know that is something I need to watch for. Perhaps I was putting people on a pedestal, expecting only words of hope, wisdom and encouragement. I can't say it any better than I did originally, I was just so unprepared to hear anything remotely like that! A few more hours and these responses have helped me put some perspective on it.Thank you, Tasha!
Stepchild - Great advice, as usual I wish I would have left it there instead of bringing it home with me! I will try to remember that for future use lol Thanks for the 13th step explanation also. I've heard the term but didn't fully comprehend what it meant.
Just another lesson on acceptance, I guess. My HP must have decided I needed to realize I need to get acceptance on things I couldn't imagine I would need to get acceptance with...
Thanks everyone!
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You can't change where you've been, you can only change where you're going
That really threw me I guess I wasn't expecting to hear anything like that and I feel kind of sucker punched. Three hours later I still feel sick in the stomach.
Hey Duchess, ...
Our topic at last night's meeting was on 'expectations' ... and how they are just 'premeditated resentments' ... This was a good lesson for you and most of us have already been through it with some other obnoxious person ...
What I'm saying is that we shouldn't go to meetings expecting to get what we want or need every time ... Cause we are setting ourselves up for disappointment if we do ... Keep in mind, we're all a bunch of drunks ... and like Stepchild said, some are 'sicker' than others ...
Someone already said, Take what you need and leave the rest ... this is a good policy ... Don't let this keep you from going to meetings ... and for heaven's sake, go to different groups ... (each AA group has it's own 'group' personality) ...
God Bless,
Pappy
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'Those who leave everything in God's hand will eventually see God's hand in everything.'
Don't sweat it...You are doing great...You learned something...Everyday you move forward and don't drink you're doing the right thing.....Just keep doing the right thing. I learn something everyday.....The day we stop seeking...Is the day we lose what we have.
Hey:) I, too, have had a few experiences like this. One in particular stands out. It was maybe my 3rd time attending this certain daily meeting. A women raised her hand to speak and began loudly berating aa members as being "full of crap", and how they are never there when you need them, and it's all bs..on and on detailing her own problems and woes regarding living in a shelter and loosing all of her possessions. She was obviously going through a really rough time and felt as though others hadn't helped her enough. Well, I was horrified, and quite shaken. This particular woman has since had similar outbursts, and it's upsetting to witness such raw anger, especially when it's directed towards a program that I'm very new to. But what can you do? Some people don't seem to want to (or be able to) make progress or see things in a positive light. It can be upsetting but, for me (and this may sound horribly callous), its good to have some examples of how NOT to work the program as motivation to try to grow.
I can only share how I am Tina - I didn't mean to imply that YOU were doing any of the things that I do... just sharing how I am in hopes you or someone can identify... and it helps me think about how I've changed already... in just a few months.
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Thanks for everything. Peace and Love on your journey.
Let no one, and nothing stand in your way Tina. I remember the first time I heard a really really negative person share. It was VERY shocking and I was fragile too... not prepared I guess. I was putting everyone on a pedestal I realized, and we're all just human... all here because we're alcoholics, and that doesn't go away. We ALL need support, the newcomer and the old timer - everyone in between, the good bad and the ugly ; )
I judged every single person in AA as if I was God when I first got here (er um... as if that was a super long time ago LOL) I still do it, but now I take my little poker out of my back pocket and poke myself... still human every time. Ask my HP for help, remind myself where I am (also not in prison or dead at least)... move on.
That person went to a meeting, and reached out. I only hope I can have enough sense to do that when my day comes. It will I'm sure. Never the less, I was JUST where you are, and I remember the sting clearly. Let nothing and no one - stand in your way Tina : ) You can do this!
Great insight Tasha. Words to live by Tina, for sure.
From the other side of the table - I was once the negative one. Christmas day meeting 2006, dry since 18th October and I was so sick. I was sick of hearing what a great time everyone else had that christmas day, I was sick of hearing how everyone had their family back, I was sick of hearing how wonderful it was to be of service. I kept my mouth shut, until I was directly asked to share. We were all standing up for the serenity prayer and I was asked, 'you've been silent all meeting, have you anything to say?'
So i let rip, both barrels, said i hated my life, I had no one in my life, that this was the worst day of my life, that I'd spent it alone, that my family wanted shag all to do with me, that they were all a bunch of selfish bastards, that God didn't exist, that the fellowship was a bunch of self congratulatory aresholes and that you can shove sobriety where the sun doesn't shine.
As i was ranting, one by one, people sat down and let me rant. (There was 7 of them, 6 women and one man)
At the end of it someone made a comment - do you want to come over for lunch tomorrow, here's my address. I told her to shove it. Then she said well OK, the door's open but if you want to wallow in your own self pity, get on with it. If you want to feel like this, keep doing what you're doing. If you want to change it, do summat about it.
Sure, I lobbed my quid in the pot, raced through the serenity prayer and I stormed off, went back home, watched crap on the TV, glared at the cat.
The next day i went to this friends house for lunch, met the man who would become my sponsor, got so much of the shit off my back and that's when i started to get serious about recovery. I was the most negative man I could be on that Christmas Day. less than 24 hours later and I really joined the fellowship, instead of just going to meetings.
This was a turning point, a tipping point in my recovery, it was what i needed to really throw the towel in. My life changed after that day. It hasn't been all plain sailing (in fact there have been times........) but that christmas meeting and my behaviour was what I needed to break down the last barrier, to burst the ego, to call out for the help - and to accept it. This was the end of my white knuckle ride and the beginning of my recovery.
All the people who were at that meeting are still sober. All the people at that meeting have told me how glad they were that I let it rip. (all of them have taken the piss about it too.) all the people at that meeting have told me one way or another that they saw the pain in me, saw the desperation and knew that this was the make or break for me. All of them are glad that I let myself be vulnerable, was offered help and accepted it. (All of them have offered help to me at some point and all of them have helped me - this is loving me better until I could love myself)
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It's not having what you want, it's wanting what you got. BB
Thanks for your honest post, bikerbill. Yours was a cathartic event--a positive one.
I suspect that the negative guy in the OP was venting in the same manner that you describe.
I have seen and heard such negative outbursts in meetings. I appreciate them for the rawness of the emotions, the starkness of the language, and the real deal level of the event. They always edify.
All the b.s. and cuteness is indisputably stripped away.
I, too, very much appreciated your post, bikerbill. Its always great to hear things from different perspectives. Its great that aa meetings are forums for venting and growth. It did help me to realize that perhaps I approach meetings with a bit of judgement on my part that I should let go of. Thanks
Thanks for the share BikerBill. My last drunk was on Xmas eve when I decided to say merry Xmas to my old buddies. I didn't plan to drink but that's what allies do.
I've seen rants, fights, thefts, drunks, overdoses, etc. etc., in meetings. We all go to meetings because we need help, not because we are all well.
I can only share how I am Tina - I didn't mean to imply that YOU were doing any of the things that I do... just sharing how I am in hopes you or someone can identify... and it helps me think about how I've changed already... in just a few months.
Not at all, Tasha! I didn't take anything accusatory from your share. What you said just made me analyze inwards
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You can't change where you've been, you can only change where you're going
If he really felt as he did, he wouldn't have been at an AA meeting. He would have blown his brains out before that. He wanted some attention for how he felt and he probably got it. It was a way for him to cry out and it worked. He needs help. I hope he gets it outside of AA.
I guess I wasn't expecting to hear anything like that and I feel kind of sucker punched. Three hours later I still feel sick in the stomach.
I wish I would have left it there instead of bringing it home with me! I will try to remember that for future use lol Thanks for the 13th step explanation also. I've heard the term but didn't fully comprehend what it meant.