Sowing what you reap

Mad_Jasper · Veteran Member

Sowing what you reap

leeu · MIP Old Timer

Nice!! And good for you for being able to view the "nod & wave" as enough said.

SUSIE · Senior Member

People apologize in different ways! Very nice!

turninggrey · MIP Old Timer

What you are going to like about this program is exactly what just happened. It does not take a General to take command of your life--just lil ole you. You took command of that situation in an affirmative action that was honest and straight forward and showed humility and guts. The more you do that, the more you are going to like yourself in a non arrogant way. I hate to bring up the marital situation, but that is who you will become, and that MAY be who and what your estranged wife may admire. Please forgive me for bringing up the subject, but when I answered your other posts this is what I had in mind. Don't count on it, but you will be a different man, and the new man may be what she was looking for. Anyway, I liked the honesty and strength it took to do that.
Tom

Mad_Jasper · Veteran Member

Thanks guys. It was a nice feeling to make amends with him. Haven't been the type of person to do that very often.

@Tom, no need to apologize. I don't talking about my marriage, I just think I need to keep certain aspects of it off the board as it seems to fire up emotions. I don't mind someone disagreeing with me, but I don't want it to have a negative impact on someone else.

Mad_Jasper · Veteran Member

I just realized that my title should have read, "Reaping what you sow". Duh.

HeatherK · Veteran Member

Hi Jasper. Let me ask you something. Did you "make amends" for your own needs or for his? You mentioned doing this so YOU could move on... So, it's all about you?

Are you already on 9th step- making direct amends at 30 days? If so, you are making AMAZING speedy progress through the steps. Most likely you are not, though and are making the common mistake of working the steps out of order. Personally, on my little pink cloud in step ONE!- I was ready to run out and start making amends passionately and recklessly, but was cautioned by many to wait to make amends until you do the other steps. They are in order for a reason. We may do more damage by doing an amends incorrectly or for selfish reasons by doing them before we have made our personal inventory (4th step), shared it with another person, ourselves, and God (5th step), became willing and HUMBLY asked God to remove our defects of character (6th/7th), and make a list of people we had harmed and be willing to make amends to each one (8th Step).

I am currently on my 9th step, and have almost 9 months sobriety. I am now ready to make direct amends to people I have harmed, after working all the other steps thoroughly in order, and have thought long and hard about each amends I have made in this step and will continue to make. First I discuss the amends with my sponsor before making ANY amends- do you have a sponsor yet? I also speak to other trusted senior members in AA and get their perspective. Then I pray to God and ask for His guidance and to remove any of my own selfish thoughts or motives from the situation. I then meditate and LISTEN to God, after meditation usually I have the clarity to know exactly how to proceed. I write out what I want to say and highlight the important parts, always searching for and eliminating selfish motives or anything that may be unnecessarily harmful to them or others. Next I respectfully set up an appointment with the person at a time of his or her convenience and tell him or her that I have an important matter to discuss. Upon meeting the person, I respectfully attempt to sweep my side of the street- NEVER divulging information that may harm the person or others, and always focusing only on what I did, not his or her part in the issue. I admit my wrongdoings, and may apologize, but am never servile nor scraping. All of the amends I make are very intentional and well thought out...and so far all have had powerful results. Relationships have been mended, forgiveness of self and toward each other has been achieved, respect has been nurtured.

I don't mean to burst your bubble, you sound proud of yourself and happy about this attempt. I am only asking that you please be careful. Making a spontaneous decision to make amends to your neighbor and then leaving him a voicemail is not exactly the way the amends process is intended to work. I can almost guarantee that after nodding and waving to you, the guy said, "What a jackass." under his breath as he drove away. If you have not worked the steps properly it is possible that even your most sincere attempts at making amends could have devastating consequences, as you most likely are still operating with selfish motives. Later, you may have to make another amends for the selfish amends you attempted to make in early sobriety. At 30 days, if you are anything like THIS alcoholic, you are still very sick. Anyway, talk it over with your sponsor and see what he says. I don't personally know you and may be way off base.

At any rate, waving is better than punching...and I'm glad you two are at least tolerating each other. :) Good luck to you! Heather

Mad_Jasper · Veteran Member

Hi Heather, I appreciate your questions and your advice. I will address your questions as honestly as possible.

I did get a sponson but we have not formally met (as sponsor/sponsee). We talked quite a while yesterday and I explained to him that I hit my knees in surrender to the Lord after the realization that my life was unmanageable and I turned to alcohol to give some sense of control over it/or escape it, depending on the circumstances. THAT is when my urge to stop drinking overpowered my urge to keep drinking. AA, the fellowship, and the Big Book are gifts from God that will help me learn to manage my life. That being said, I will not seek a consensus in determining God's will for MY life. AA is not my god, the fellowship is not my conscious, and the Big Book is not my bible. But they are tools that the God of my understanding have giving me, along with the Bible, study materials, Christian counseling, prayer and meditation to help me learn to live for Him... to seek His will. No one can tell another person what God's will is for their life, that must be found by the person that seeks it, at least that is how I believe. God has placed people in my life, including one very close friend in AA, that will help me ensure my motives are honest and pure, but again, they can't tell me what God's will is for my life. In my spiritual journey, I have probably worked parts of several steps because the coincide with spiritual principles, but not purposely. I think it will be better for me to meet my sponsor before I begin. I shared all of this with my sponsor and he did not seem to disagree with my approach.

I had prayed for this amends since I surrendered to God. During the Sunday service, I was convicted that I needed to act on this amends and one other which I will post about Friday. As for whether amends for my needs or his... hard to answer. I don't know him that well so I can't claim to know his needs. I called to request a face to face meeting, but gave him the option to call or accept (or not accept) my apology in a voice mail. While it not be the "ideal" way to make amends, instead of revving his engine when he drives by, throwing beer bottles in my yard, and yelling obscenities at my wife, he gave a "wave and nod". I don't really care if he thinks I'm a jackass.... this is a HUGE improvement of GIGANTIC proportions. I suspect that since he was willing to "wave and nod", there has been a release of tension which is good for both of us and our families.

You did not burst my bubble. I AM very proud and happy about this amends. Not only because it appears to have diffused a tense situation that has been brewing for nearly a year, but because I wasn't capable of this a month ago. I wasn't capable of this 5 years ago before alcohol took a hold on my life. This is the process of removing a character flaw (arrogance) and replacing it with a positive character trait (humility). I am only capable now because I have FINALLY surrendered to God and He is beginning to work through me. It like the title reads (or supposed to read) "Reaping what you sow". I'm allowing the seeds of forgiveness, patience, kindness, and other spiritual principles grow in my heart and it is beginning to produce fruit, albeit a tiny, small amount right now. I'm proud and happy and passionate because of what's God is doing in my life!! It's awesome and I love talking about it.

But all this being said, I ask God to reveal any selfish motives in my actions and to help me remove them. He has been faithful.

-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Wednesday 23rd of March 2011 05:27:01 PM

-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Wednesday 23rd of March 2011 05:27:14 PM

pinkchip · MIP Old Timer

Jasper. I am really glad you are making progress. Don't be so sure that you cannot receive God's will through another person or the fellowship though. I have had myself saved many times by the fellowship of AA and by individual members of AA. God works through people and you will miss miracles if you assume you know God's will for you to the point that nobody has anything to teach you.

When people say things to you in AA that you might not agree with....look for the parts that maybe make just a bit of sense. Recovery is a slow process and growth and change don't happen overnight. I was told "slow down" and "one day at a time" and "more will be revealed" cuz I thought I had it all figured out after a month too.

Step 2 says "Came to believe." It does not say "already believed in a set of religious ideals that did not work to keep me sober in the first place." In the old days of AA, you would be told to sit down and shut up...to take the cotton out of your ears and stuff it in your mouth...that you have nothing to share with us because you don't know squat about staying sober....

I personally don't agree with this and I am happy to watch your recovery process just as people listened, commented, and gave me suggestions here from when I started posting at 60 days sober. BUT - knowing that this is the culture of AA, why not ask us how to stay sober and show some humility in that way? That is truly how AA works.

It is one person helping another. Other people probably know God's will for you better than you do with only 1 month sober. You are convincing yourself you are showing humility, working on character defects....but it is all over the place. Work the steps with a sponsor in an orderly fashion....Follow instructions....Let that Ego get deflated a bit.

Steps 1 through 3 are your foundation and the have to be solid enough to last and to build your whole program upon. If you move too fast it is like building a house on faulty ground. It will collapse. A slow recovery is what we want here. Trust me.

Either way, keep the enthusiasm and just soak up as much 12 step knowledge as you can. Don't assume you have steps 2 and 3 down because you are a Christian person with a strong faith already. There are principles and daily practices that go along with those steps that you will miss if you gloss over them.

billyjack · Senior Member

pinkchip wrote:
Jasper. I am really glad you are making progress. Don't be so sure that you cannot receive God's will through another person or the fellowship though. I have had myself saved many times by the fellowship of AA and by individual members of AA. God works through people and you will miss miracles if you assume you know God's will for you to the point that nobody has anything to teach you.

Hey there Jasper, The most valuable things I have learned, are the things I have learned after I knew it all. My God is the God of the bible, and He has always worked through people. Mostly people who were screw ups and were serching for truth. King David always come to my mind first when I think of spiritual people and making major screw ups and then getting back on the path. Pink chip is right, the worst thing you can have is a closed mind toward the infinite power of God. In the Big Book, step two asks us to " lay aside predgedus " That simply means to lay aside the things I think I know. There are times I can be filled with so many things I think I know, I cant be taught anything new. Its a debilitating. Keep coming back jasper, seek and you'll find..

Mr_David · MIP Old Timer

Great thread...Thanks