Alcoholics Anonymous
Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Miracles In Progress 12 Step Recovery Forums -> Alcoholics Anonymous -> Alcoholics Anonymous -> Most of us are IN recovery from Alcoholism, but we still have different preceptions
Post Info TOPIC: Most of us are IN recovery from Alcoholism, but we still have different preceptions
Just Toni


MIP Old Timer

Status: Offline
Posts: 996
Date:
Most of us are IN recovery from Alcoholism, but we still have different preceptions
Permalink  
 

Hi Everyone,

Was re-reading a few times a Post that got so involved with the Chips and what they mean to each of us.

For me I was such a hard and fast relapser, for soooo long, about 7 years of relapsing,   and in the first 2 or 3 years would go in and get a white 24 Chip..after that 3 years was too humiliating to get another......then as time went by............they could be found all over my house, in every drawer, dish that held keys always had a few, and pockets, let me just say, every single pocket of any jacket or skirt you could find a white chip.......and of course where would some end up, at the bottom of the washer, and hopefully not the dryer.

So with the Help of my Higher Power, whom I always choose to call God, Real Recovery began, a Meeting everyday for the first 2 and half years.....but the strange thing was I had developed a real fear of white chips.....still to this day only have one Bronze Chip.

I traded it with a wonderful friend for her favorite too.

Now let's see, can I say White Chip Phobia, ....biggrin.... well it might not be found on Wikipedia, but I have it.....if you had collected hundreds of hundreds of them, think you would understand.....think I read a little fear in someone else about the chips.....

But at the same time, White Chips are so very important to anyone that is just getting started, and to any that collected just a few also wonderful......

Hope no one was offended at my words.....and if I have, my heartfelt apoligies.

Tonicakes



-- Edited by Just Toni on Sunday 10th of October 2010 05:59:40 PM

__________________
gonee


MIP Old Timer

Status: Offline
Posts: 1503
Date:
Permalink  
 

Here in South Africa we do not get any chips. We celebrate our AA anniversaries by sharing a meal with our fellow AA members and families. When I came into the program, I was taken straight to a 12 step program meeting. It was not a discussion meeting. I was taught the steps there and got sponsored there also. I took down notes and studied the AA book. I went to meetings every day. I shared when I was asked to share. The result is I have stayed sober despite myself.

__________________
But for the grace of God.
LinBaba


MIP Old Timer

Status: Offline
Posts: 805
Date:
Permalink  
 

gonee wrote:

Here in South Africa we do not get any chips. We celebrate our AA anniversaries by sharing a meal with our fellow AA members and families. When I came into the program, I was taken straight to a 12 step program meeting. It was not a discussion meeting. I was taught the steps there and got sponsored there also. I took down notes and studied the AA book. I went to meetings every day. I shared when I was asked to share. The result is I have stayed sober despite myself.



Absolutely agree, me too, that is my experience as well


However, in the "greater" AA we do have different perceptions about many things, and that's OK

For example, I am not "IN recovery", or "recovering",  I view that point of view as treatment center propaganda, I am "recovered" because I worked the 12 steps, that means after working the steps I now have no excuse for ANY of my character defects including selfishness and self centered fear, and to me I see many people use the terms "in recovery" and "recovering alcoholic" as a way to keep themselves sick, now I don't care what anyone else wants to call their sobriety, but for me it's like having a skin condition for example, where if I go in the sun I get burns and blisters, I can either look for better ways to treat the burns and blisters, in which case I still have a problem, ie I am recovering or in recovery, or I can stay out of the sun or buy a hat and wear long sleeve shirts thereby removing the problem -recovered-

The "Recovered" school of thought does things a specific way as the word recovered is in the first sentence of the book Alcoholics Anonymous, They come in, follow suggestions, work the 12 steps out of the book, they don't say "No" to AA, they give back to the organization that saved their life, and then sponsor others in the same exact way (out of the book) as they were sponsored and give back to their fellowship by doing service, by speaking at meetings, by picking up trash, setting chairs up, picking chairs up afterwards, by manning the phone lines, by going on 12 step calls, in short they work the Program of Alcoholics Anonymous and get well, I have seen us called "The AA Service People" on this very forum like we are some seperate entity that others can just leave the responsibility of actually running the meetings, sponsoring others etc. as they run in to grab their "fix" of an hour of serenity before running back out, relapsing, not knowing why, crawling back in begging for help then disregarding the suggestions as they go back to doing things their own way again, then doing the same thing over and over (relapsing or being tortured by the bedevilments) and wondering why they keep getting the same results.

It's funny because ANY good sponsor will ask first thing, "are you prepared to go to any lengths?" and of course we say yes, but once we get a little sobriety under our belts, and we don't -have- to go any lengths to just not drink, we toss that promise out the window and then we can't figure out why we don't get over our shyness, our self centered fear, our fear of people, in short we don't do as suggested then have a group of still suffering sober alcoholics running around afraid to face their demons who view it as manipulation when their sponsors try to get them to honor their Word, the one in which they said they were prepared to go to any lengths

Well it's human nature to work just hard enough to stop the acute suffering then stop, thankfully God invented the Ego which is the burr under the saddle, which brings us enough pain to have to do more work despite ourselves, God was no slouch that guy lol

So to me, if you want to be "recovered" from a seemingly hopeless condition of mind and body in which our chief defect is selfishness, self centeredness, and self centered fear, you follow a specific formula in which service and sponsorship plays a large part, and if you want to be "recovering" or "in recovery" you do things a little more cafeteria style, a little of this and a little of that, and you aren't required to do nearly as much of that pesky "helping others" stuff in order to get out of self and it's frequently justified by being too busy (selfishness-self centeredness) or the folks are just afraid (self centered fear)

So yes, many of us do have different perceptions, and that's OK, thankfully we do have the "recovered" crowd or who would secretary the meetings? Who would speak at them? Who would be there to carry AA's message? Who would man the phone lines and be there to welcome the newcomer with an answer to Alcoholism and give freely enough of their time to help them and not just give them their phone number?

In AA we have a bolt to fit every nut that suffers from alcoholism, and it says, sometimes quickly, sometimes slowly but it will always materialize if we work for it, work being the operative word, sometimes that work is simply smiling at someone or holding their hand, sometimes that work is speaking when we are called upon, but if we want the pot of Gold, there are the operative words.

Work for it

For some folks it takes months, years and even decades,  and some never do "get it" even if they stay sober, and that's OK, that includes people from the "recovered" camp as well, I am by no means attached to my way is the only way, and we come in at varying levels of illness, and we get "well" in equally varying degrees, but if we do work for it, there is always improvement





-- Edited by LinBaba on Sunday 10th of October 2010 08:05:39 PM

__________________

 

it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
Dave Harm


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 435
Date:
Permalink  
 

The fun part is when a "program of recovery" becomes a "program of discovery"

__________________
"A busy mind is a sick mind.  A slow mind, is a healthy mind.  A still mind, is a divine mind." - Native American Centerness

Creating Dreams, from the nightmares of hell...
angelov8


MIP Old Timer

Status: Offline
Posts: 714
Date:
Permalink  
 

Today I feel I want as much as I can get.  Hp knows how much I can handle!

__________________
SUSIE


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 479
Date:
Permalink  
 

That is how it has been for me Dave......a real program of discovery....well put!

__________________
Sobrietyspell


MIP Old Timer

Status: Offline
Posts: 3057
Date:
Achieving sobriety & helping others achieve the same..
Permalink  
 

I feel I am recovered just for today. I'm sick of arguing with the fear & ego inside me. I'm standing for the courage to be honest, real & true. This program works when I work it which I do progressively. I stay close to the principles & I'm aware when I go off beam. I live in the solution. It's the best route I've learned out of fear & into love, my Higher Power, my God. My only task is to keep growing along these spiritual lines & keep reaching out which I do everyday. It is a beautiful & very busy life I try to also keep simple. I don't want to be considered bodily or mentally different to others which is why I may object to being considered 'in recovery' but having written all this now I don't really care as I'm grateful for all grace & change which has been given me. I did take offence at a student asking me a few days ago if I consider myself in recovery & I was triggered, 'What do you mean am I? As opposed to the normals on the street do you mean!' My ego had a right blast which made me wonder nevertheless why I was so bothered. I let go again but like I opened my post with I made a decision to stand up for my recovery & identify myself as recovered. I'm no different than anyone else except I have a program in my life & a desire not to die an alcoholic death. Alcoholism is a self-diagnosis. Perhaps this is too, aye! Thank you for the post, Toni x 1Day@aTime, Danielle x

__________________
Progress not perfection.. & Practice makes Progress!
louisa


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 463
Date:
Most of us are IN recovery from Alcoholism, but we still have different preceptions
Permalink  
 

For me, since I like to keep a "beginners" mind, I feel more at ease with the term "recovering".  My boyfriend calls himself  "recovered",  we respect each other's individual choices. 

LB while I admire your ability to cut through so much alcoholic bullshit and quote verbatim from the Big Book, I found that for me when I did that that sometimes I almost lost the "spirit" of the message.

I feel lately there has been a "bash a shy person" tone to some folks shares.  Whilst I am fully aware that shyness is described  as character defect and  based on "self", (and also in the knowledge that it is not a competition for the greatest defect) , there are perhaps other "defects" which do more harm, such as  lack of restraint of tongue and pen  -  as in to make one's point at all costs.

Like has been said, the promises come to us, sometimes slowly, and we must work for them..

Bill shares in "Humility for Today" June 1961

"Don't try to get too dam good by Thursday. That old time admonition may look like another of those handy alibis that can excuse us from trying our best. Yet a closer view reveals just the contrary. This is our AA way of warning against pride-blindness, and the imaginary perfections that we do not possess"

Somebody who could barely say their name in the beginning in a meeting, who is now able to share and comfort others and carry this message through the program,  I feel is a wonderful example of this program working, that person may still suffer from intense shyness but is gently growing. 

God is the judge. I may never fully overcome my shyness but if I die sober, having played my part in helping others to do the same then I feel the matter of my shyness pales into absolute insignificance.

My shyness does not stop me reaching out to the homeless AA and buying him/her a Big Mac whilst telling them my story, it never will - but it does stop me getting up on podiums.

I am fully aware of my character defects and honest about them, to myself and to my sponsees, I let them know that it is progress not perfection and it is not a race.  For me, love and service are the key.

I cannot endlessly quote verbatim from AA Literature, but I can, and do , like many other "shy folks" carry the "spirit" of it.

I keep in mind a quote from Dr. Bob's  farewell talk July 1950 before he died,

"Let us also remember to guide that erring member, the tongue, and if we must use it, let's use it with kindness, consideration and tolerance"

A sober day wish to you all - and to any newcomers who happen upon this share.....you can do it and it is SO SO worth itaww

Love always
Louisa xx

(((Toni))) You remain in my prayers - (((Big Hug for you)))






-- Edited by louisa on Tuesday 12th of October 2010 06:40:15 AM

__________________
Sober today thanks to the Miracle of AA
Larry_H


MIP Old Timer

Status: Offline
Posts: 1008
Date:
Permalink  
 

handshake.gif
Recovering vs recovered.  I started to jump in the fray and realized that I would only be sharing my opinon.

I was always told that opinions are like a**holes, everyone has one and to keep it to myself.

In AA we learn to share Experience, Strength and Hope not opinions.

Larry,
----------------
Don't give me advice...
Tell me about your Experience and Strength...
It gives me hope...



__________________
Rainspa


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 268
Date:
Permalink  
 

In my experience, (and btw the experience of those who research such things) the number 3 fear of people is death.

#1?

Public Speaking.

I forget what #2 is, but I bet someone here knows.

In my experience, there were times that I have had a severe fear of public speaking. Rare but serious. Enough so, that when given the order to speak at my 6 month birthday, I figured out that if I crossed the street, got a beer and drank it, then I would no longer be sober, could come back to the meeting, and would not have to get up on that podium.

I told my sponsor of my plan, and my wish that I didn't want to do it, but I REALLY could NOT get up and speak.

They gave me my chip anyway. Finally. It was very close run. The tipping point may have been that a chip, a cake and six months that I wanted were not enough to overcome the fear.

I may have been shy or a nut or just deer-in-the-headlights fearful coward, but I was a SOBER shy, nutbar, deer-in-the-headlights coward.

Shy, introverted and fearful, IN MY EXPERIENCE, (and I have experienced them all, thank you very much, (thankfully not so much anymore) are not the same as willfullness, selfcenteredness and pride. Which I have also experienced, natch.

Dissernment is a strength that I am claiming today.

__________________
Klaatu


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 227
Date:
Permalink  
 

I agree with the OP. I consider myself recovered from alcohol (I don't drink anymore) but in recovery from alcoholism. I think we can all agree that alcoholism is a progressive, incurable, and fatal disease. In my mind a person doesn't ever fully recover from that sort of disease, so I am in recovery from it. I have recovered from the obsession of alcohol however (thank God for miracles). That's just my way of thinking. I honestly don't give it much thought, that's not keeping it simple for me.

K.....

__________________

Nothing ever truly dies. The universe wastes nothing. Everything is simply, transformed.  :confuse:
Page 1 of 1  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.
Miracles In Progress 12 Step Recovery Forums -> Alcoholics Anonymous -> Alcoholics Anonymous -> Most of us are IN recovery from Alcoholism, but we still have different preceptions