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Post Info TOPIC: Who is the youngest member of this board?


MIP Old Timer

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Who is the youngest member of this board?
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Hey all,
I can not get Misu's post below out of my mind because of how lucky I was to have quit pretty early.  I was a sophmore in college so I must have been 20 or 21.  (I was one of those late starters due to being a young drunk) Of course I did "slip" "relapse" or just plain "get drunk" on a number of occasions.  But I am concerned about the fact that "spiritualism" is a required end product of AA and I am such a dried up old man (think Mr Crabs from Spongebob) that I am out of touch with how young AAers view their HP or their spiritual side.  I am a little concerned that the spiritual side of AA ran "Tipsy McSwagger" off and I do not know how to tell folks like Misu not to think that we pass judgement nor do we claim any arrogant righteousness that may be linked with high pressure religions.  So who is the youngest and what do you all think?
Tom

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Certainly not me, at 55, got sober at the age of 36, but I was given some good pointers when I was 'searching for Goddo' some of the things I was told were

'Stop looking, he/she ain't lost'

'Don't worry if you don't understand God, he/she does understand you'

'God can mean - Grow Or Die - Group Of Drunks - Gift Of Desperation - Good Orderly Direction'

'You don't have to believe in God, so long as you stop believing YOU are God'

'Religion is for those of us who are scared of going to hell - Spirituality is for those of us who have already been there'

'Just keep an open mind and all your old ideas will fall out'

One of my favourite parts of the Big Book is Appendix II - Spiritual Experience, which states

SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCE

The terms spiritual experience and spiritual awakening are used many times in this book which, upon careful reading, shows that the personality change sufficient to bring about recovery from alcoholism has manifested itself among us in many different forms.

Yet it is true that our first printing gave many readers the impression that these personality changes, or religious experiences, must be in the nature of sudden and spectacular upheavals. Happily for everyone, this conclusion is erroneous.

In the first few chapters a number of sudden revolutionary changes are described. Though it was not our intention to create such an impression, many alcoholics have nevertheless concluded that in order to recover they must acquire an immediate and overwhelming God-consciousness followed at once by a vast change in feeling and outlook.

Among our rapidly growing membership of thousands of alcoholics such transformations, though frequent, are by no means the rule. Most of our experiences are what the psychologist William James calls the educational variety because they develop slowly over a period of time. Quite often friends of the newcomer are aware of the difference long before he is himself. He finally realizes that he has undergone a profound alteration in his reaction to life; that such a change could hardly have been brought about by himself alone. What often takes place in a few months could seldom have been accomplished by years of self-discipline. With few exceptions our members find that they have tapped an unsuspected inner resource which they presently identify with their own conception of a Power greater than themselves.

Most of us think this awareness of a Power greater than ourselves is the essence of spiritual experience. Our more religious members call it God-consciousness.

Most emphatically we wish to say that any alcoholic capable of honestly facing his problems in the light of our experience can recover, provided he does not close his mind to all spiritual concepts. He can only be defeated by an attitude of intolerance or belligerent denial.

We find that no one need have difficulty with the spirituality of the program. Willingness, honesty and open mindedness are the essentials of recovery. But these are indispensable.

There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorancethat principle is contempt prior to investigation.

Herbert Spencer

The bit I have made bold says it all for me, I do believe that I have had a personality change sufficient to bring about recovery from acoholism, had I not had, I would still be drinking or dead.  It's only with hindsight that I can see the simplicity in it, for me it took a long time for the penny to drop, so al I can share with newcomers young or old is my own experience, for what it's worth.






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MIP Old Timer

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It might be our latest newcomer Misu smile.gif

A couple months ago I thought that we had a 16yo

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Religion is man's search for God, while spirituality is God's search for man...

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"A busy mind is a sick mind.  A slow mind, is a healthy mind.  A still mind, is a divine mind." - Native American Centerness

Creating Dreams, from the nightmares of hell...


MIP Old Timer

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Nice quote, Dave.
My homegroup had a 16 year old guy for a couple of weeks after he got out of treatment, then he moved. Really took me back.

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MIP Old Timer

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I could read those quotes all day.

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MIP Old Timer

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I don't know who is youngest, certainly not me... LOL

But we ALL speak the language of the heart if we are alcoholics, no matter what our age is.

:o)

JOni

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MIP Old Timer

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Looking at the question from just a bit different angle the answer comes out
since we all just have 24 hours at best were all working on a day.  I've had
the pleasure and blessing of my HP using teens as instruments in my own
recovery so the "God angle" for me is very deep and very broad.  Younger
recovering people don't have the amount of time trying to beat the beast as
older more stubborn (oppositional defiant) fellows.  They learn faster even
after experiencing many or more of the depths older members have reached
...over and over and over again.  I love listening to the younger recovering
members in my meetings just as much as I rely upon the more experienced
in recovery.  Miracles have different shapes, sizes, colors, tones and characters
and with an open mind they all teach me so that I can be of use to others.

smile

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MIP Old Timer

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I think Kristin might be the youngest person that posts here with some months of sobriety.  Other than that, I'm not sure.  I don't think we drove Tipsy off in any way shape or form and I do think he will be back.  That was an example of a person that probably needed the program but did not and does not "want" it.  Besides, Tipsy ain't that young by my recollection.  I guess in my experience coming into AA, I was not turned off by the whole spirituality component of the program.  I felt dead inside and I knew it could only help me.  I was open to hearing anything and pretty much trying anything because things had gotten that bad.  If I could reach out to any other young people reading this, I would tell them AA is a journey and it doesn't require religious conversion.  It is about recovery and most importantly, the recovery of your soul.  Once my mind cleared some from pouring regular toxins in which clouded my perspective, I became open to see a wonderful world around me which only God could have a hand in making.  Coming to believe is a process and it takes time.  Most oldtimers and people with long-term sobriety have a stronger faith simply because of being sober longer, working the program longer, witnessing all the miracles of life, and utilizing a higher power to see that God will help them get through the good and the bad without having to drink or use. 

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MIP Old Timer

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Well said PC

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MIP Old Timer

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Here's a little fun trivia for you....

1. Throughout the discussion between Yahweh and Moses, Moses seems reluctant to attempt to lead Israel out of Egypt. At one point, he said to God, "Behold, when I come to the children of Israel, and tell them, The God of your fathers has sent me to you; and they ask me, What is his name? What should I tell them?"

God replied, "I AM WHO I AM, and he said, You shall tell the children of Israel this: I AM has sent me to you."

This introduction to Yahweh as the personal name of God associates the divine name with the Hebrew verb hayah meaning to be. I will be what I will be indicates My nature will become evident from my actions.

2. Om" or Aum" is the basis of all sounds in the universe.The "Aum" of the Hindu Vedas became the sacred word of "Hum" of the Tibetans; Amin of the Moslems; and "Amen" fo the Egyptians, Greeks, Romans, Jews and Christians.

"Om" is the all-pervading sound of emanating from God in His aspect of Creator, the voice of all things in creation, testifying to the Divine presence in every atom.

The great Hindu sage Patanjali said;"He who knows "Om" knows God."

3. Tao both precedes and encompasses the universe. As with other nondualistic philosophies, all the observable objects in the world - referred to in the Tao Te Ching as 'the named' or 'the ten thousand things' - are considered to be manifestations of Tao, and can only operate within the boundaries of Tao. Tao is, by contrast, often referred to as 'the nameless', because neither it nor its principles can ever be adequately expressed in words. It is conceived, for example, with neither shape nor form, as simultaneously perfectly still and constantly moving, as both larger than the largest thing and smaller than the smallest, because the words that describe shape, movement, size, or other qualities always create dichotomies, and Tao is always a unity.

While the Tao cannot be expressed, Taoism holds that it can be known, and its principles can be followed. Much of Taoist writing focuses on the value of following the Tao - called Te (virtue) - and of the ultimate uselessness of trying to understand or control Tao outright. This is often expressed through yin and yang arguments, where every action creates a counter-action as a natural, unavoidable movement within manifestations of the Tao.

PS. "Tipsy" comes and goes as he wishes, and as he has a right to do.  I believe that he is an articulate young man (I say that because he is younger than me.) who hasn't given up, or gone away, but is still seeking a truth that will work for him as his own 'touch stone' to be the base for his own sobriety.  I am sure he will 'pop' in from time to time, to stir things up with his unusual sense of humor.



-- Edited by Sick of being sick on Monday 19th of October 2009 10:17:25 PM

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