So I have been having coffee with another AA'er for quite a while. I am a Christian. She is a non believer. Our get togethers have been fine under the condition I let her talk on and on about her not believing in God--or a Higher Power-- and how she thinks AA is brainwashing others with their "religious" program. It was understood early on in our meetings that her tolerance to hear about anyone else's God is extremely low. So, I tried to comply as best I could and I kept my mouth shut about while I listened to her barrage of criticisms.....prayer in the rooms! I We should not be using the word "God" and "forcing" people to pray. (I don't recall ever going to a meeting and seeing anyone tied up and forced to pray. I didn't tell her that--I am too nice and didn't want to start a confrontation.) The Big Book is full of God, God, God. It needs "editing" she told me. I really have not felt the need to defend the Big Book. I have basically been called stupid for believing in a Higher Power. This person is one of those who needs proof. That's fine. I have had no need to prove that my belief is any better than hers. I talk quite a bit on here. You would never know that I am a pretty good listener though. Most of our meetings I don't do much talking. She gets annoyed when I share. That's been alright though. I figured it was more important for her to have me to listen to her than for me to talk.
After a year of hanging out with her and do service work I realized something. I thought I had to say yes to everything I was asked to do in AA. I have pretty much done that. I have put in an incredible amount of service work with my home group, baking treats for 2 years straight only to be told by this "friend" yesterday and a couple of others throughout this time I am doing it for "attention". Like one man told me, "You don't have to do all that work for attention, just wear that black dress you wore the other night!" I laughed but realized he is right in a way. I could do plenty of things for attention without spending money every week (which I really don't have because I make well below poverty), spending all that time making the stuff. I did it because I was trying to do something nice for other alcoholics and I did it because it was helping keep me sober as long as I knew I had to do it for the meetings. So I was very hurt when this "friend" told me that the other day. I was also very hurt when after listening to all her many problems about every damn conceivable thing under the sun and being a good AA'er, one of the two times I really unloaded on her because I really was having a bad day, she told me to "stop talking" and that she was "feeling" my "anxiety" and didn't want it affecting her serenity.
Anyway, that is when I pulled back my AA hand. No longer will I feel obligated "to always reach out the hand of AA" to everyone, everywhere. My serenity is important. I am taking a break from baking as well and letting someone else do it for awhile. I was getting tired of being told that certain things I would bring were not liked or not as good as such and such. The day before I went to coffee with her another AA'er made a joke about the way I smelled because there was a sewer leak...."Oh, you decided not to take a bath before you came tonight?" I was in tears by the end of the meeting when yet this same person who said that did something else that upset me.
I am taking a break from those meetings. Maybe a break from AA. I have put hours almost every day into helping others, doing service work and things are going crappily for me. I'm tired and AA doesn't have to be my life anymore. Thanks for listening to me vent.
-- Edited by hopefulone on Thursday 6th of August 2015 04:52:47 PM
Thanks for the vent! It's not an unusual situation. Please keep in mind that alcoholism is cunning, baffling and powerful. And even when we take good actions for the best motives, and do our best to do those things ONLY for those good motives, we sometimes still end up placing expectations on how we think others should respond to those actions, and how they ought to appreciate those actions, without even realizing it. Because in addition to being alcoholics, we are HUMAN and this is a very human thing to do.
And for most humans, there's no serious repercussion from these types of day-to-day annoyances and resentments. But that's not true for us.
The problem is that, because we have alcoholism, our alcoholism will latch onto those situations and draw our focus to them until we have a serious and persistent resentment about it, and THAT is exactly where our alcoholism wants us. Because THAT is what it needs so that it can to tell us to turn away from EVERYTHING that is keeping us sober, and thus, return to drinking. Resentments are very dangerous for us, and this is why.
Of course we have the choice of who we want to associate with, in or out of AA, and what kind of service work we do, and we have the choice to change those decisions as the need arises. And we SHOULD do so when warranted, and we should do whatever else we need to do to address our resentments, such as a 10th & 11th step (and no, I'm NOT suggesting that you just have to put up with everything). But as soon as we start letting resentments over these things start telling us stuff like 'maybe I'll take a break from AA altogether......" Well, that's a huge red flag. Is that really what would be best for your sobriety? When someone says they want to 'take a break from AA' and yet they have never even considered what they should do INSTEAD, and what they would REPLACE it with, in order to assure they still stay sober, that is a big smoking gun that alcoholism is using your resentment as a weapon against you. Just my two cents from my own experience with these things.
Sounds good, Hopefulone. And please keep in mind that 'getting over it' and 'forgiving' the other person are not the only options we have for dealing with a resentment. Sometimes we also need to do something a bit scary like standing up for ourselves and calmly yet directly telling someone else that it's not okay for them to insult us, or we can point out that friendship and conversation is a two-way street and that when we take the time to listen to the other person, we'd appreciate it if they treated us fairly and did the same for us. This can be done with a smile, and one-on-one, and like a responsible adult. And having cleaned up our side of the street and having made our feelings known, it's up to the other person to decide if the will respect our wishes, and if not, we can choose not to subject ourselves to more of the same from that person. Of course one person's progress is another persons backsliding, depending on if you're someone who needs to work on being more assertive or someone who needs to work on practicing restraint of pen and tongue, so you're right - get your sponsors input on this. Anyhoo, glad to hear you're staying around. Alcoholism is cunning, and it lies to us. Don't believe it.
yes we ,i can be very sensitive,,and i cant control my emotional natures,,
That is why we have steps 10 & 11,,because i have problems with personal relationships & my life is unmangeable, i just cut somebody out of my life because of there toxic behavoir we are not doormates.
Sometimes these thing happen in sobriety ,that is how we learn, today i no what the problem is an its the man in the mirror .
Thanks again for your support and encouragement, dave, as well as bluesman..... This particular relationship I have no desire to "save". It has been one-sided for a long time and actually every time I met with this person I felt very "anxious" myself because of all the negativity, boasting, and AA bashing as well as getting called "lame" and "bitch" (which she said she was calling me that because she likes me--I don't get it, she did, that's all that mattered). I just didn't have the need to call her on her stuff and was trying to be there for her while compromising my own self respect.
I even offered to help this woman move not one-- two very heavy sofas (with the help of another AA'er I asked) because she said no one would do it and it had to be done in a couple of days. I thought she was going to help and when we showed up she was all dressed up ready to go on a date after we finished--dress and heels--not moving attire. So she watched us while we did it and told us where they needed to go. Now, I am not a young un and physically, since I was smoking then, and not doing any exercising, I thought I was going to have a heart attack because of the steps we had to go down the front porch and down the basement and the distance we had to carry these things and they had to be carried up on end through a narrow passageway between two houses. I had sweat dripping off of me like you wouldn't believe, while she just watched me with a big grin on her face and when I had to stop so I wouldn't pass out, she was still grinning and said "Are you alright?" So she knew I wasn't. Anyway, I will never move another sofa again unless it is my mom's or my own. Hire a dam* moving company--I ain't one. Or more like, keep my mouth shut and not offer. I did it to myself. I want to help others. And I do know I need work about the expectations thing. I do expect others to treat me decently and not insult me. And if I am listening to your crap for months on end, I kind of expect you to listen to mine when I have a problem. I have decided though not to get too close with any more members. I have my sponsor. I have my mom. Most of all I have my HP, who is God, and I have felt like I couldn't share with that "friend" about how important my HP is to me because I have not wanted to insult her. I am a weirdo! That's for sure. I think my expectations of others is going to be extra low from now on because I am not going to want to set myself up to get hurt like this again. My eyes are hurting so much from crying for the last two days. You would think someone close to me died. I know my reactions to these things-- being told I "stink" in front of a room full of people and to "stop talking"-- are not all that big a deal. If I would have told either of these two or both of these two people to go do something physically impossible to themselves with a grin on my face, I think I would have felt better about myself standing up for myself. (Although dave, your way is much better).
Sorry, still venting. Anyway, I have cut her out of my life. Got my meeting(s) today. Appreciate the support on here so much. Helping keep me sober. I am not in a good place so really am grateful for it. Still off booze, still off cigs, I did up my coffee intake, though. Lesser of the three evils. :)
-- Edited by hopefulone on Friday 7th of August 2015 08:58:54 AM
I describe my boundaries much like limits. As in... how far will I go in any situation or circumstance. I can't change others... only myself... so what can I do? What is my limit? Can I begin to start trusting myself to uphold limits I set for myself?
Xxxxhugsxxx
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Thanks for everything. Peace and Love on your journey.
It all sounded good except for this part: " I have decided though not to get too close with any more members. " We need to avoid this kind of all-or-nothing thinking, because it is an overreaction that could just be another way for alcoholism to try to shut us off from the life that would be best for us and lead us back to isolation, right where it wants us. There are plenty of great people in AA that would make great friends and there's no reason to lose out on those relationships just because of someone else who isn't a good choice for a friendship. You just need to make the right choices. It's similar to the idea of quitting all AA meetings because of something that happened in a few meeting. There may be a bit of a pattern in your thinking here that you might want to look at with your sponsor. You certainly wouldn't be the first person in AA who has a tendency to think this way. I speak from my own past experience
And of course, all this stuff about choosing who we build relationships with is all separate from the concept of being 'the hand of AA' and helping people with their sobriety, and we should be doing THAT regardless of whether the other person is a spiritual giant or still shaking with DTs. For example, talking to a newcomer after a meeting about step one is not the same thing as helping someone move a couch. One of these is carrying the message of AA, the other is just doing someone a favor.
thanks again, dave. I am hoping that after I write out that 4th Step and talk it over with my sponsor it will help. I remember feeling a big sense of relief after I did that the first time. And stuff that had been bothering me for years didn't anymore. Also, an added bonus was that things in general on a daily basis which ordinarily would have upset me--didn't. It was like an alien came in and took over my mind. Then "I" returned. I'm sceered!
I will bring up to my sponsor what you suggested. Also, I guess I took that "whenever anyone anywhere needs help" prayer too seriously. I did not realize it was okay to just keep my mouth shut. I have done so much stuff which I really didn't want to do, however I did just because I wanted to do what I thought we were supposed to do when asked.
Fraid my trust level is pretty messed up right now. Hopefully, prayer and meditation, as well as time will help that. The other person who made that "bath" comment to me was a newcomer and someone who I had helped and that stung, too. When I get my feelings hurt, I retreat and just want to lick my wounds. I did make two meetings tonight and although I thought about sharing, I kept my mouth shut and listened. The first meeting I kept tearing up all the way through it. If I would have shared I would have been a blubbering idiot. And I cannot really share about anyone else in the rooms in the rooms anyway.
-- Edited by hopefulone on Friday 7th of August 2015 06:34:11 PM
