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Post Info TOPIC: Warning About AA's Success Rate Articles
betterthanyesterday52


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Warning About AA's Success Rate Articles
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I have been reading some articles about the success rate of Alcoholics Anonymous. There are some grim "findings" (or so they call them) and I question the accuracy of such articles because since it is an anonymous program how can any of these "results" possibly be accurate? I think they are BS! Some of the "writers" of the articles seem to have a very negative opinion of AA's effectiveness in helping alcoholics stay sober and imply that AA's program is "outdated" and "too strict"among other things. I wonder if any of them is an alcoholic, tried AA, didn't work the program, etc., and now are posting this info to dissuade other alcoholics to try it. I wonder if they ever had any experience with an alcoholic who is destroying his or her life and/or who has died because they never got help for it. Maybe they feel since there are so many alcoholics that this would be a "great" article and draw more readers and then they could get tons of hits and have more advertisers wanting to use their site. (Thus making a profit off of our disease!)

It could have been discouraging to me if I had read some of these before I got sober, I may have been inclined to think "what's the use?" and that it would be highly unlikely for me to be in the very small percentage of people who stuck with the program and maintained their sobriety for any length of time back when I didn't even think I could get one day under my belt. It is kind of like reading reviews about a movie and a few people saying "it's a waste of time" to watch it and I make my decision based on their decision. I could miss out on watching the best movie I have ever seen. Only it is so much more serious than a movie...suppose even one person reads that BS and thinks they are not going to "waste their time" by giving Alcoholics Anonymous a chance and continues to drink. That is one person who may die by that decision who could have been saved.

I will have to say that I had some time on my hands earlier. I really didn't need to go and read that stuff. I know that AA is working for me and I don't need to find that out by reading about the "research" on five or so groups or the results of surveys sent to thirteen hundred alcoholics who quit AA to tell me that (Ha!)  I do agree with one of the articles making note of the importance of doing service work. If I just went to meetings and relied only on the meetings I know I would probably be drinking now.

I do know that AA is not a magic pill. It will not magically get me sober. It requires me being more committed to my sobriety than I am to anything else in my life. It has to be my number one priority because if it isn't I will start drinking again and nothing else will really matter because I will end up dying anyway. I have to continue to work the program, not get too comfortable with whatever stage I am at in my sobriety and "keep it fresh". If some of those "writers" would have interviewed some of the many thousands of people with 5, 10, 20, 30 and more years of sobriety who have gotten and stayed sober because of AA, then it would be more realistic. AA is, after all, an anonymous program and no one has asked me. And there is a reason for that.  I know we have freedom of speech in this country. I only hope that while these "writers" are trying to convince us of the "low success rate of AA",  that their negative AA postings/articles do not end up actually decreasing the percentage of people who would have given AA a chance to save their life had they not read their BS.

(And I put some words in quotations sometimes when I am not sure if I am using the right meaning of a word or if it is applicable to what it is I am trying to say, such as "writers" above.)

"Progress not Perfection"

"Keep it Simple"

"One Day at a Time"

You can do it, too!

I AA and you all (yaw!)

BTY



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Stepchild


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I don't pay a whole lot of attention to that stuff BTY...One thing that I do know from what I have witnessed since being in AA. The people that have worked the steps....And continue to live on a spiritual basis as outlined in steps 10, 11 and 12 are still around....Myself included. I see a lot of people come and go.....That don't take the steps.

Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program...

BB pg 58

They must have witnessed the same thing as they wrote the book and AA consisted of only 100 members. It's pretty cut and dry from what I can see.



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2granddaughters


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AA is 100% successful if you commit to it. I am living proof, I should have been dead in 1989. I'm saying COMMIT, not be involved.

Like a bacon & egg breakfast, the chicken is involved and the pig is committed.

AA doesn't have a great "Grey area" in it's success rate and that is well described in HOW IT WORKS.

Half measures availed us nothing ... we held on to our old ideas and the result was nil until we let go absolutely
We asked his care with complete abandon etc etc ... you get the drift.

 

All the best fellow MIPs

 

Bob R



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Philipld


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A lot of what you read in those articles is likely true...Every so often New York does a survey on numbers.....at the area and group levels....and come up with percentages...and those percentages are not great...

Those numbers are given out....and the press do their thing and make a big negative story about it

Names are not mentioned so it still remains anonymous..

Stepchild and 2Granddaughters are dead on....

Theres a lot that don't want it...a lot that are looking for easier softer ways.....and theres a lot that don't wish to do the work..

The few million that are still in AA...DID THE WORK....and continue to do so



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Angell


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It is my belief that the AA fellowship is not what it once was. This is not the result of the AA program changing but of the AA fellowships' changing demographics. It does not surprise me in the least when someone with six months drinking under their belt gets stopped for a DUI, sentenced to AA attendance, fulfill the courts requirements and goes back out. Society's definition of what an alcoholic is, has the bar set so low now that people are coming to the program little more than potential alcoholics. If you are convinced that you are an alcoholic, if you are certain that you've suffered sufficiently, and if you are desperate enough - then you inherited the old 75% success rate.

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Philipld


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I fully agree with that Angell



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Pythonpappy


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My sponsor told me that AA is 100% successful ... it will not and cannot fail, never has, never will, ... IF a person follows the suggestions in the BB ... ... ...

People will fail, but not the AA program ... the program in and of itself is a perfect way to live life ... the steps are right out of the Big BB ...

The Big BB tells us that the gate is wide and many are they that follow the path to destruction ... and also that the gate is narrow and few are they that will enter therein to the heaven we seek ... so, ... less than 10% success rate ??? ... we 're told in the Big BB that that's the way it is ... (from 2000 years ago) ... ... ...



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betterthanyesterday52


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I agree with all of you except about the percentages being right (sorry Phil)...I just don't know how they could possibly make that assumption by even a NY survey---as that is just NY and they never do an attendance count at any of the meetings I go to. Maybe I just don't know that much about that kind of stuff, however.

I used to go to a meeting where there would be sometimes a dozen slips which had to be signed by the Chair. Some of them shared that "if" they had a problem with alcohol forcing them to attend AA was not going to help them stay sober. (I agree). And there are people being forced to go to these meetings which are not alcoholics, so thanks for giving me some info I didn't even think about, angell. So if those people are included in those statistics, that right there in and of itself is proof that those figures are off.


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Philipld


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If youde like to know more about it? Ask your GSR for your group..or even better ...get in touch with your DCM for your District..?

When New York does their surveys? They'll get group membership numbers...which add into District numbers...which add into Area numbers...and so on up the line..until they get total counts...

If they do that periodically? which they DO....They can tell by the numbers from the past survey...

I was DCM for this area 8 years ago..for 32 groups..and the percentage rate on THAT one..between one year and five years? was 3 percent..

That's not even taking into account the ones that pop in and out...or don't join a group..

 



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Tomas


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I've been sober in AA over 40 years.. AA has not changed One Iota... same Big Book, same 12 steps..God doesn't deal in statistics..statistics are ONLY for losers..forget the statistics..forget the losers stick only with the winners..

I don't even read that rubbish..sobriety is in the halls of AA..Not for people who need it but those who want it.

I live an unbelievable life because of my sobriety..and I could not have done it without AA.

As a new comer I was told don't analyze...utilize..

If you are sober today..the program is working..what else do you want?

Don't set yourself up for failure..Remember alcohol is cunning baffling and powerful..and that propaganda on statistics is very cunning giving those who want to drink an excuse

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Philipld


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I have been reading some articles about the success rate of Alcoholics Anonymous. There are some grim "findings" (or so they call them) and I question the accuracy of such articles because since it is an anonymous program how can any of these "results" possibly be accurate? I think they are BS! Some of the "writers" of the articles seem to have a very negative opinion of AA's effectiveness in helping alcoholics stay sober and imply that AA's program is "outdated" and "too strict"among other things. I wonder if any of them is an alcoholic, tried AA, didn't work the program, etc., and now are posting this info to dissuade other alcoholics to try it. I wonder if they ever had any experience with an alcoholic who is destroying his or her life and/or who has died because they never got help for it. Maybe they feel since there are so many alcoholics that this would be a "great" article and draw more readers and then they could get tons of hits and have more advertisers wanting to use their site. (Thus making a profit off of our disease!)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

I fully agree with you Tomas..

All I was doing was replying to the above paragraph...:)



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betterthanyesterday52


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Gee, I don't know Tomas....guess I have an unquenchable thirst for knowledge (LOL)....it's better than having it for alcohol. And I'm not setting myself up for failure at all. My concern is not about me--it is about the active alcoholics who read those things and may be influenced by it. So much of what I post is that I am hoping to help them. (Ok, sometimes I just like to vent..) I know you oldtimers are believers. I am too, and I think most of my 1900+ postings confirm that.

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Philipld


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If youde like to know more about AA and its service structure? BTY? Go here..:)

Alcoholics Anonymous : Structure of the Conference (U.S ...

aa.org/subpage.cfm?page=379

Structure of the Conference (U.S. and Canada) ... written permission of Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc." CONTACT US; SITE MAP; SITE HELP;

 



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Philipld


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Plus maybe go through the 12 Traditions in the 12 and 12....

All this stuff is what keeps AA together as a whole



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betterthanyesterday52


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Thanks Phil for the info. I am aware and have been going through the 12 Traditions. Good stuff!

As far as the service structure of AA I am not very knowledgeable about that so that will be helpful and I appreciate it. I have a pretty full schedule with meetings and service work now but hopefully in the future I will be able to be of service in the Intergroup in my area. That is if I feel God leads me in that direction. It is His call, not mine.

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mikef


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Yup WE accept our 1st Step(100%)incorporate our Solution,the program (pg.59 3rd edition BB) (daily)application of the Steps in all areas of our lives and remain free of ever taking that "first one" again..WE remember also that Dr Bob told us he spent a great deal of time passing on what he learned to others who wanted and needed it badly..(pg.180 BB)WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR OUR OWN RECOVERIES....just for today..WE...Don't drink alcohol,, we work in the Solution daily  and WE ARE  guided by OUR Higher Power in all things...Statistics will just be another man made report ,,,,WE know what we have to do to remain in sobriety based on the evidence...smilesmile



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betterthanyesterday52


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Oh and also thank you for giving me some more useful information to read... I just read that when you make a 12th Step Call it is taking part in "World Service". I just read the Inside AA online pamphlet. It is really fascinating. I love reading this so much more!

OH, just read something I need to do a new posting about....



-- Edited by betterthanyesterday52 on Friday 16th of May 2014 10:59:28 PM

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Mike D


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I recall being in an A.A. meeting, when I was in my first few years of sobriety, and there was a guy there who was loudly spouting-off about his failure to stay sober.  He was saying stuff like, "I've tried A.A., but it has never kept me sober."  "A.A. doesn't work for me."  "A.A. won't work for everybody."  Listening to that, and everything else he said, he made it very clear that what he meant by "I've tried A.A...." is that he had only attended meetings -- he'd never tried working the Steps.

Perhaps I've learned as much from the losers in A.A. as I have from the winners in A.A.

The A.A. 12 Step Program works 100% of the time.  The  A.A. Fellowship doesn't.  The Program and the Fellowship are two entirely different things.

Mike D.



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