That's interesting Jerry...I'm not real sure I'd want to do 6 4th steps....Not sure I'd want to do 2. I don't see anywhere in the directions where it says you should.
I guess for me my "tap root" was fear.
Notice that the word "fear" is bracketed alongside the difficulties with Mr. Brown, Mrs. Jones, the employer, and the wife. This short word somehow touches about every aspect of our lives. It was an evil and corroding thread; the fabric of our existence was shot through with it. It set in motion trains of circumstances which brought us misfortune we felt we didn't deserve. But did not we, ourselves, set the ball rolling? Sometimes we think fear ought to be classed with stealing. It seems to cause more trouble.
BB pg 67
This is where my sponsor helped me see how major of a part fear played in my charactor defects.
This paragrapgh sums up step 4 for me.
Referring to our list again. Putting out of our minds the wrongs others had done, we resolutely looked for our own mistakes. Where had we been selfish, dishonest, self-seeking and frightened? Though a situation had not been entirely our fault, we tried to disregard the other person involved entirely. Where were we to blame? The inventory was ours, not the other man's. When we saw our faults we listed them. We placed them before us in black and white. We admitted our wrongs honestly and were willing to set these matters straight.
BB pg 67
-- Edited by Stepchild on Sunday 20th of October 2013 07:20:17 PM
T...my greatest emotional character defect was fear and that emotion also was firmly attached to my ego and my need to protect itself at all times right, wrong or indifferent...I needed to be on top of it all and not shakey about anything. Displaying fear made me appear "less than" and therefore questionable and I didn't want that...ever. I was always afraid and my friends and foes couldn't decipher it because of the front I put on. There were times when i would say I was and my friends would question it because of outside appearances and over the top behaviors in very risky situations. I had a situation once where I was being held at gun point by a police officer who I had "walked on" and obviously had frightened because I wouldn't stop. A friend of mine was standing on the sidewalk opposite the stop chanting to the police officer "you better put him down" several times and then I could tell the officer wasn't ready to use his gun. I told him to holster it because it could be used against him...and he did. My "friend" now lives on the same island I do and I might never find out why he chanted what he did...maybe it had something to do with what he thought of my fearlessness. The psychological profile for the alcoholic points out for one that we are "risk takers" and in my emotional 4th step I didn't find where that meant fearless. When I was drinking I put myself and my friends and family in high risk and frightful situations often; maybe there are levels of fear that count, I don't know. I know when I was a youngster in my alcoholic family of origin I use to feel terror and panic...who knows maybe I found a way to cover it up well with all of the adrenalin. Adrenalin is another chemical we get under the influence with when we drink because of the situations we often find outselves in...an upper and a depressant at the same time. I did 6 4th steps because I had to learn about the one person I had lived my entire life with up until that time and knew nothing about. I was also diagnosed as a dual personality. I recommend searching and knowing for real. Mahalo for the thread.
-- Edited by Jerry F on Sunday 20th of October 2013 09:57:57 PM
Hi everybody....I've been thinking about this lately and I hope you won't mind if I share about it. I remember back some 15 years ago when I was attending my regular Home Group meeting on a Saturday night. The chairperson had chosen "Acceptance" as the topic of discussion.
We had about 75 people there, and it started out to be a pretty normal A.A. meeting. But eventually, things changed. As the sharing moved around the room, a young woman stood up and blurted out that she'd been having trouble understanding how to go about writing out her Fourth Step inventory. She'd read the instructions in the Big Book dozens of times, and was working with a sponsor, but she was getting nowhere. She then asked if anyone could possibly show her what to do. After she shared this, another guy piped up and said he was having the same difficulty -- he was trying but getting confused with the writing. Then another person, and another shared the same dilemma. Then others said they were having similar problems. It disturbed me to hear that so many people were stuck in Step Four, and I tried to think of a good way to give them some help. After that, it seemed that the topic had now become Step Four instead of "Acceptance". I was elated.
When the meeting came open for anyone who wanted to talk, I spoke up and asked our crowd, "Is anyone else having trouble with this Step?" To my amazement, about three quarters of the people in the room raised their hands! Holy smoke! We had a huge problem here! I then asked them if they thought a Step Four Workshop might help them out. It was unanimous! Everybody raised their hands! Yes, all of them definitely wanted a workshop....and the sooner the better!
Long story short, the first Fourth Step Inventory Workshop we did in our Group was packed with people. Quite a few brought their sponsor along with them. And, that was only the beginning of many more Fourth Step Workshops that were held at our meeting place and even many many more in other towns and surrounding areas in the following years. As we did workshop after workshop in various places, I quickly discovered that way more folks than I ever thought were having trouble with certain parts of the Steps....the biggest one being Step Four!
What's the point of this little story? Well, I guess the point is that there are many A.A. members who have trouble with various Steps but are too shy, or maybe too afraid, to speak up and raise their questions. All too often, they are referred back to their sponsor who may, or may not, be able to give them the kind of help they really need. The best thing that ever happened in our Group was when that young lady spoke up and changed the topic.
The hand of A.A. must always be there to reach out and welcome the newcomer. Welcoming new folks at the meeting door is great. But, I still believe that shaking hands at the door is only a beginning. Most importantly, we must extend our helping hand when they need help working a Step. After all, we all know that real recovery only comes from working the Steps. Step workshops can be a brand new beginning for those who are struggling in our Groups. After we did the workshops, we noticed that our Group membership had grown. We also noticed that the relapses went way down. Have you ever thought about doing something like this in your Group? Thanks for allowing me to share, Mike D.
I think I've said before it's my opinion this step knocks more people out of AA than any other step...I just finished a Big Book work shop an old timer does where we covered the first 103 pages of the book....The directions. This went on once a week for a little over three months...I think there were only a few of us that attended every week...Some came a few weeks and disappeared...Some came for one week...I was disappointed with the attendance. They say AA isn't for people that need it...Or people that want it....It's for people that DO IT. I think it's a great idea....Maybe it would be better just to go with a fourth step work shop....Since that is the one where a lot of people get hung up...It's funny how it's the first step that requires action....I wonder if that has anything to do with it? One thing I'm curious about Mike D.....What was the main problem people were having with this step? I've also heard it said that the only way you can do the fourth step wrong....Is by not doing it. There may be something to that. Thanks for the share....Good stuff.
P.S. I sometimes feel there are far too many Acceptance meetings and not enough fourth step meetings....I would have been quite happy to hear that topic change.
Ya know, I was just trying to remember whether I had been to any specific meetings where the fourth step was the primary meeting topic on a routine basis ... ... ... Nope, can't say that I have, but I think it a really good idea ... I have been to 'book studies' out the yin yang and they were usually either BB studies OR 12 & 12 Step studies or even one time we had a 'As Bill Sees It' book study ... ... ... but no 4th step study dedicated to this step ...
I have to admit that during my trips through the 'revolving door' of my past AA experience, I did have a lot of problems with this step ... now, years later, I think it was due to my really not wanting to face an HONEST review of my past ... that, my friends, scared the poop out of me ... not to mention that it was very, VERY depressing ... I think it made me also feel unworthy of God's grace of forgiveness ... I felt unforgivable ...
Ya know? ... the more I think about it, the more I remember wanting desperately to put a lid on my past and bury it deep enough to not face it, ever again ... and the thought of digging all that shit up was something I really couldn't face ... well, that is until I got sick enough to 'go to any lengths' to stay sober ... and I now know the reason we wish not to shut the door on it ...
Great new 'thread'>..I look forward to the responses ...
God Bless, Pappy
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'Those who leave everything in God's hand will eventually see God's hand in everything.'
Personally I had no problem with step 4 because my sponsor knew I would not be able to do it on my own. He spent a full day with me helping me get my 4th on paper, patiently helping me understand every aspect.
I think you are right in suggesting that many people get stuck at step 4. It is the first "action" step and perhaps that is more than some are prepared to do. Perhaps they hear stories, as I do, of how difficult it was to write a 50 page epic novel with 3000 resentments listed, and they think they could never do that. Perhaps their sponsor is telling them they are not ready, when the real reason is the sponsor has not done the 4th step either. Perhaps they are conflicted with the advice to "take their time" over the steps. Probably most reasons for delay on the fourth step are rooted in wrong information.
For the real alcoholic, however, delay just puts off the urgently needed treatment of their alcoholism and we know, from experience, that will mean unhappiness at the least, or a slip and/or death at the worst.
I used to like "acceptance meetings" but I'm not sure why. Perhaps it allowed me to talk about me instead of the solution. Now I would say acceptance means two main things to me. First that I have alcoholism (though this acceptance is not enough to get me sober) and secondly that I accept the AA solution. The evidence of my acceptance of the AA solution is manifested by my taking action on step 4, and the subsequent steps. While I remained unwilling to take action on the fourth step my talk of accepting the first three was just so much hot air.
Hi Step Child, thanks for responding. What I found is that most people seemed to have difficulty with the latter part of the inventory process, and they got confused when it came to relating their three basic instincts and their character defects with their actions. They always said that they easily understood what to do in the beginning part. But, as they moved on through it, the instructions became ambiguous to them. However, after a four hour workshop where the whole process in the Big Book was carefully explained to them, section by section, they could finally understand how to proceed. What also helped was that I gave them the "Joe & Charlie worksheets", and they wrote a short "sample inventory" right there in the workshop. Getting them involved "hands on" made a difference, I think. Asking questions helped them a lot too. The big thing was that no one ever walked out with any confusion left in their minds. They said they knew exactly what to do -- start to finish.
At that first workshop, I expected maybe around 15 people tops. We ended up with over 30, and the more workshops we did, the more people showed up for them. There were also quite a few folks from other cities who I'd never met before. What increased the attendance, I think, is that our A.A. Central Office had tons of our workshop fliers that went out all over our district.
I can greatly relate to what you said about all the never-ending supply of meetings on "Acceptance", and then of course there's the old stand by,"The Promises". I'm with you, newcomers need to hear more about the Steps, and so do us older folks. Thanks and blessings, Mike D.
Perhaps they hear stories, as I do, of how difficult it was to write a 50 page epic novel with 3000 resentments listed, and they think they could never do that. Perhaps their sponsor is telling them they are not ready, when the real reason is the sponsor has not done the 4th step either. Perhaps they are conflicted with the advice to "take their time" over the steps. Probably most reasons for delay on the fourth step are rooted in wrong information.
Very good points...When I left my rehab two weeks early...I had enough understanding of the book....Because that's all I did there...Was read and reread and reread it...That the three pertinent ideas in How It Works...The first 2 steps were clear to me...I was convinced.
(a) That we were alcoholic and could not manage our own lives.
that our lives had become unmanageable.
(b) That probably no human power could have relieved our alcoholism.
We admitted we were powerless over alcohol
(c) That God could and would if He were sought.
Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
So it goes on to say....Being convinced, we were at Step Three.
When I selected my sponsor...I told him I was done with my first three steps and ready to start writing inventory....He told me to go home and say the third step prayer from the book and to start writing...And that's what I did. I didn't get to hear the things...Which I heard later...And still hear today...About how hard that step is to do...How painful it is...I was open minded about it because I didn't know any different...I prayed a lot for help and asked a lot of questions....But I just set aside an hour a day where I could be alone with God...Put it down in black and white...And do it. I really think I was blessed that I didn't hear all that crap about how hard it is...Because it is misinformation.....And with this illness that we all have in common....Misinformation can be deadly.
I've come to understand that most people that talk about how hard that step is to do...Haven't done it.
EXACTLY!!!!! How could I forget....Gratitude meetings. Another effective way to avoid talking about the 12 Steps!! Good one....I'll bet we could think of even more.
I like the subject and the memories it brings up for me...the good ones and the bad ones. As a newcomer in the rooms of Al-Anon I had to start somewhere and I started with the lack of understanding and energy and so my first sponsor kicked me and my half-assed effort out of the door and then hooked me up with a "male" sponsor...yes that defect was on a subsequent 4th step. My sponsor was good at leading 4th step inventory meetings and when he did them he backed the room. That was not a guarantee for me because I was still green and before my second 4th he told me "don't turn it in....I don't wanna see it" because he asked me how many things were on each side of the (split page) inventory. His feedback was that I was off balanced in my perception of the step and I redid it. The third attempt we went to the requirements of the step word after word..."searching" ...."fearless"...."moral" and he had me look up the definition of each word before we went to looking. That attempt was great and I "came to understand"...me...who I thought I was, what I had done and who I had become before understanding what I needed to change in myself. In all I did 6 4th step inventories with him the last one identifying the "tap root" of all of my defects...the one major root which fed all the others and when I was done and turned it over to him; he looked at it and looked at me and said, "Good...now what"? That last 4th step had one word on it...I had found the tap root and knew what to do. If you read the word as it is normally written; as an acronym it means one thing. Turn the word around (the opposite) and the acronym becomes the solution to my defect. This is a simple program and it gets simpler as we continue our practice. The acronym for EGO...Easing God Out. The opposite? OGE...Offering God Entry. This is now my 24/7 ammends...impossible to forget don't you think? Hope it helps.
I haven't heard of any specific workshops for any of the steps in this area. I have heard in some of the meetings members sharing that they have problems with this one. Personally, I am not looking forward to taking a "searching and fearless moral inventory" of myself. For one thing, I have been fearful for a great part of my life and anything that requires being "fearless" on my part is hard for me to imagine. Also bringing up all of my carp and having them all staring up at me from a piece of paper doesn't sound like fun. Pappy's response pretty much summed up how I know I will be feeling once I do it--wanting to "put a lid on my past" and finding it "depressing". Another reason is that I am somewhat lazy and this step requires a certain amount of effort on my part. I guess they all do, but I do know that when I was in school many many years ago, I hated homework and sometimes halfway did it or didn't do it at all. I was no honor student.
I do know from what I have heard and learned since I have been in the program if I want to stay sober it is necessary to complete all of the steps as thoroughly as I possibly can and I will just have to try to get over my hang ups about this step as well as any others I have about any of the other steps. I have yet to read that this is an "easy" program requiring little work. Very helpful post, Mike D. and I hope that I remember this when I do start working Step 4. I guess I am grateful today that I don't have to do that step right now and can focus on working the first step with my sponsor's help.
-- Edited by betterthanyesterday52 on Monday 21st of October 2013 04:49:30 AM
Fear - Face Everything and Recover, Fu/' everything and Run. Quite good acronyms. I still have my 4th step. When I review it now I see fear at the core. Fear of what? fear that my base instincts would not be satisifed. I was reduced to living by instinct. When my existence is so reduced to just three instincts, put them into one lump and you might have EGO. I get what both of you are saying. You both make sense to me.
The dreaded inventory step is the fork in the road. To skip it is to work something similar to the AA program of recovery. To do it is to do the work to join the thousands of people that have recovered from a hopeless state.
Just that simple. And AA even claims it is not the only game in town to get sober. I'm happy for anyone that is able to get sober. Keeping it in perspective, working only part of the program does not carry with it the Promises. It may or may not work.
On working it, a bit of time with your sponsor will help. I would say within an hour you should have it. If it makes no sense and seems like something foreign, maybe waiting is in order.
Willingness is the key. Pray and be open to do the next right thing.
It is a good thing to want to follow the program. :)
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"I spent a lifetime in hell and it only took me twelve steps to get to heaven."
"Experience is not what happens to you; it's what you do with what happens to you."
