Good to hear from you Murray : )

Self-control is an interesting topic. I think Pappy and Mike have a point: I think it might be easy for an alcoholic to lull himself into thinking he has some control over his drinking. But the OP isn't talking just about drinking. He's also talking about fasting as a spiritual discipline, which is a completely different animal.

I have to exercise a certain amount of self-control in various facets of my life, finances being one of them. I also have to force myself occasionally to do things that don't particularly interest me - that's just a fact of life when you have a job and family. Not everything is fun.

I wish I had some self-control when it comes to smoking. I've been trying to quit, but nothing works. It turns out I'm just as powerless over tobacco as I am over alcohol. It mystifies me that getting sober was easier than quitting cigarettes.

-- Edited by Q on Monday 15th of July 2013 07:53:10 AM

I too think it's about more than fasting and the primary purpose here is to stay sober so.... I think the OP is also expressing some misguided ideas about being king of self-control. I quit drinking for several months on my own also but then I remember thinking that life was boring and something was missing and I picked up again. After picking up then - it was much worse than if I'd never stopped. Without the AA meetings, stepwork, having a sponsor, and spiritual toolkit AA provides, I lacked the resources to really change my thinking and my life. So while I did have decent self-control....I also learned it wasn't about self control. It was about spiritual growth, healing, and not being so vulnerable to relapse due to really working the AA program. I had to change the person I was....not just quit stuff. I will admit I have stayed sober out of spite sometimes and I'm basically thinking whatever works for you... I had relationships in the first year that I was suggested not to have. I went out to bars periodically (though not until my second year) when people told me I had no business in bars. BUT - I know I had the program behind me through all of that.

So, if you have your HP, lots of meetings, stepwork, and the whole AA shebang behind you....keep moving full force. You can "quit" anything you want. I changed radically and parts of it were from my own decision but the follow through and the energy and the shift in thinking to make those changes last came from my HP and from AA. Without that you are just on the wagon and quitting stuff to prove you are not powerless. Just waiting for the twisted alcoholic thought to emerge "Hey MandM, you worked in a bar, quit eating during the day, quit smoking...You are not an alcoholic. Go ahead and drink and you can just quit again easily if you need to!" With no meetings or AA toolkit - you will likely drink when that happens.

So...this is an AA forum - not "Quit drinking on your own and congratulate yourself for it Anonymous" - I hope you are going to lots of meetings MandM and really trying the program. I don't mean to sound judgmental or like I'm pooping on your successes but I tried it the way you are describing and it didn't work. I finally surrendered and did it through AA and it did work so that is my ESH. Before AA, sobriety never stuck. AA changed my thinking and my lifestyle so as to make me not as vulnerable - though I must remain vigilant and not get complacent even after a few years of sobriety now.

Either way, I am happy for you. Truly. Being able to do the things you are shows willingness and whether or not your are working AA yet, that is one of the major predictors of success in AA... That will work in your favor in the future. So it is good.

I remember a cycle that my brother had. He'd go to rehab, come out of rehab, live by a good program, his life would get better, he'd gain confidence, thought he had control, got a little cocky, ran the show, started drinking or meth, then returned to rehab. 6 times I saw this cycle. Twice the cycle included wives, and once included a child.

Even though I watched it and I didn't escape alcoholism. It got me, or I go it!!

My cycle involving control was not as intricate. My binge drinking got progressively worse. Kept the party going until I blacked out. At times drank during the early morning hours. My control issues revolved around the insane thought that I could handle the alcohol this time.....yet depravity is where it led me. Never did a rehab, but, had black outs and other depraved incidences. Don't miss them at all!

Had numerous problems, then I surrendered control.

Be careful mandm, using the term complete control just put a shiver up my spine!!

Thanks for sharing...and I'm glad your life is better!!

I don't see anyone who has been here for years obsessed with drinking?

I see people who drift away from the program start to drink again and then the obsession returns, and then they come crawling back in bravery to tell us that it still sucks - don't drift away and don't be overly confident in your ability to do it alone and stuff like that. But I see NO one who is working the program who is still obsessed with drinking after years and years.

mandm wrote:

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lol you guys are funny, i'm not saying i'm going to start drinking because I have a sudden wave of control. I am saying my self control is just getting better and better.

and in no way would i ever want to go back to drinking.. ever that chapter is over for me, which is why I don't like comming on this board anymore, I find people on here that are too many years sober are still obsessed over drinking, and its depressing. I don't even think about alcohol any more, its not even a problem when I go out, i just say I don't drink and thats it. Its pretty easy for me now, I know it wasn't before.

its like a bad break up, your not going to get back with your ex if she hurt you really bad, I'm not getting back with mine :p

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 Hey mandm, ... Well, for one, I didn't suggest you would start drinking again, I just suggested to be very cautious (and I feel that was the context of the other posts)... 'cause every time I started feeling a little confident, it came back to bite me in the a$$ ... ... ... you have what ? 90 days sober ? ... I can't remember ... but we are here to help you on a daily basis because we want to be ... if you feel you are handling things well own your own, great ... then we can feel good that maybe, just maybe, we helped a little bit ... 

I pray you can come back after a year or five, and say "in no way would I ever want to go back to drinking" ... we have no idea what the future holds, but, neither are we afraid of this when we stay in 'fit spiritual condition' like MikeH said ... 

I miss your regular input here and hope you post more often ... in any event, we'll keep the light on for you ... 

 

God Bless,

Pappy

 

Fyne Spirit wrote:

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Doctor Bob expllains why we do it very well:

"I spend a great deal of time passing on what I learned to others who want and need it badly. I do it for four reasons:

Sense of duty.
It is a pleasure.
Because in so doing I am paying my debt to the man who took time to pass it on to me.
Because every time I do it I take out a little more insurance for myself against a possible slip."

God bless,
MikeH.

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 There is NO better way to explain it ... ... ... Thanks Mike

 

 

Hi mandm,

I can see myself in what you write. I understand; I feel, felt, am still, feeling the same way. I think we both just want to surrender and say enough is enough; and just accept the fact that we're both pickled oranges. I really don't like authority figures hovering over me; especially when I know more than them. And I really don't like following rules, either. But seriously though, do we have any other choice but to surrender?

I don't know about you, my friend, but this is a something that I don't care to ever revisit, ever again. It is more than I can handle, and it beat me. kudos...

That's right, reasonableness. Why can't we just be reasonable? Why does the word "alcoholic" make people scatter? That's not right. I wish we lived in a world where we could say I am an alcoholic, no thanks I have had enough; not work, and just play on my computer all day.

Those of us who have to work 8/5, I would like to hear from you. How do you do it?

It's working, that's what matters, and I am smiling for you. I have been reading a book this weekend titled "UnDrunk". I think A.J. wrote it for me (nah, for all of us).
Thank you Stepchild, for not leaving me alone here!

GoJo wrote:

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Those of us who have to work 8/5, I would like to hear from you. How do you do it?

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 Hi GoJo,

for the first 6 weeks of my sobriety I was incapable of work. For the next 32 and a bit years I worked, often 11 or 12 hour days in sales, owning a restaurant, owning a service business. How did I do it? By living in steps 10, 11 and 12.

Since December, I have been semi retired, living on my boat and starting a new adventure, but I still live steps 10, 11, 12.

God bless,

MikeH.

GoJo wrote:

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 Actually, the night I posted this question in my prayer before bed I told God I just simply can't do this, something has to give. I have no way of explaining this, but the next morning things were much different, for the better. I have had a good week. I am staying a little while longer after the meetings to help fold chairs and chat with people, starting to open up more although I still haven't shared or read a reading. But I am finding myself relaxing more. As a matter of fact, just today at work a crisis came up and I actually caught myself by surprise by handling the situation with something that I had picked up either here or at one of the meetings. It was remarkable, a good feeling.

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GoJo that sounds like the beginning of something called Faith...Keep seeking and let it grow.

(a) That we were alcoholic and could not manage our own lives.
(b) That probably no human power could have relieved our alcoholism.
(c) That God could and would if He were sought.

C is the answer.

 

MikeH: it feels great to be positive, thank you for seeing that. There's a story to how you came to sobriety, isn't there? I wish I was in one of your weekly meetings. I fave found, I'm much more productive and comfortable in the actual real life, face to face, not internet, meetings.

What I would like to know is what I keep hearing about, "fear". I'm not afraid to face it, but what in the world is it, what is this fear I should be not afraid to face?