I have been sober for 151 days and become a very active member in the AA community. My wife filed for divorce in April, 2012 after several druken blackouts and it will be finalized in April 2013. Although I realize it may be too late, I would like to ask her to go to an Al-Anon meeting with me. I feel it would be beneficial for her to learn a little about the program and the progress I am making if only for our kids sake. My hope is that one meeting will lead to another.... and she will understand what the fellowship is about and my commitment to the program.
She is (understandably) angry and bitter about our situation.
I have no idea how to approach her with this request.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
-- Edited by bucknut12osu on Tuesday 29th of January 2013 11:19:02 PM
Welcome to MIP bucknut12osu....I guess for myself I would rely on the two things that have helped me in AA more than anything else....Prayer and honesty......It's hard to go wrong with that combination.
If she is angry and bitter, you may want to hold off even attempting doing a 9th step with her, let alone asking her to attend Al-Anon. If it doesn't feel right, don't risk losing any of what is left of your relationship for the sake of anyone but yourself right now. As selfish as that sounds, the first year is for YOU. Concentrate on working the program, going to meetings and God will take care of the rest. She may or may not even ever accept what you have done. Only you and your higher power can do that. Admitting you are powerless over alcohol will not work until you accept this as a fact as well.
Stepchild had some good advice. I might ask her to go to an AA speaker meeting first. A lot of times this will get people to start looking at themselves at some and you might be able to nudge a little from there.
Implying that she has a problem and needs Alanon may not go over so well given the situation, best that it becomes her decision. Maybe let her know you would be willing to go with her if she might be interested after the AA meeting or two.
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Rob
"There ain't no Coupe DeVille hiding in the bottom of a Cracker Jack Box."
A lot of good advice above. I recommend you talk honestly with your sponsor and the oldtimers in your group.
Perhaps you have and thought you'd go on-line and get a "second opinion" .....
Truth is your sponsor and the oldtimers know you and your situation first hand. I know you as a new username and some sentences of text. I can offer no useful advice.
Folks who care and know you and your wife/kids/situation first hand will be able to help.
Sometimes, in our blind disease, we push Humpty Dumpty off the wall and then pi$$ & moan about not being able to put her together again.
Thank you all for replying. I believe my motives are clear, as I am getting sober for myself, my children and God. I don't believe there is any chance of reconciliation but my God hates divorce so I have faith that He is working in my marriage. The Big Book tells me not to fight in the case of divorce but I can't believe it would have me sign away my relationship with my children. I have been praying and asking for guidance as suggested by my sponsor and oldtimers.
If I was going to try and manipulate someone into giving me a second chance before I had truly made any real changes in my life as the result of working the program, I would probably start by being a really really great parent, and letting the other parent see that change in me - more so than work over the other parent because hey - the kids matter here anyway and they deserve the real - and really good - parent that has probably been absent in their lives for who knows how long (I know I was absent even when I was present while I was drinking). So just be an awesome and I mean AWESOME dad for a while - and not just to let her see you or hear about it - if you're doing it for them... truly for them, and in turn for YOU then she'll notice and hear about it and feel it and see it and might get curious just enough to open the door a crack at some point.
We know so little about your situation, and it might be a lot more complicated than what you're letting on here... but no matter what... the kids deserve a great Dad, and you need to work on you and your program first and even ahead of them for a while to get to be that great dad for them... in my OPinION> best wishes : )
-- Edited by justadrunk on Wednesday 30th of January 2013 07:57:09 PM
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Thanks for everything. Peace and Love on your journey.
Aloha Bucknut12osu and good intentions you do have and a loving spirit...isn't that the good guy in you...damn alcohol can mess things up!! Ask your sponsor or anyone else in your home group if they have a spouse or family member willing to do a 12step call on your wife and then turn it over to HP. Get the heck out of the way including trying to figure out how it came out. 151 days for me was just enough time to remember which direction I should travel in to get to a meeting. I wasn't drinking and I was still crazy...no one in my program pointed in my direction and said "ask that guy" when a newbie was looking for help...I could be honest but didn't know when to. How do you ask...ask someone else and ask your HP for the courage. Keep coming back.
I tend to agree that if she is still pissed off and hurt, now is not a good time to ask her to let you off the hook and reconsider her decision to divorce you. My experience has been that it, more often than not, sets the stage for a big ol' NO!
Instead, I can only suggest a few things that might bring her to a place of becoming willing to reconsider without having to be asked to.
Send flowers, frequently, consistently... like every three days.. with nothing but a note that says,... I love you. If you cannot afford to have them delivered to her by a florist, you might consider leaving them on her door step but not if she has a restraining order in place. You might really want to see her really bad, but during the flower deal, you are invisible. She gets only the flowers, not another opportunity to look at your sad, puppy dog face. That will not win you any points at all. The flowers is all she should be seeing when they are delivered or she discovers them. If flowers seem like a bit too much, you can surely do the same thing with a card. However, it should not be one that ask the question you are wanting to put forward, instead it should be a general, "you are valued and loved" card. Not overly mushy, but not a comedy card either.
Now, while doing this... get to work on your steps with a sponsor... work you forth and fifth step... they could take a little bit of time, then move onto your 6&7 steps... then write out your 8th step list... her name will surely be on it... and then.. talk to your sponsor to help you put together a sincere amends. Not an "I'm sorry", but a change (amend) that you can present that makes the wrongs right, and see how she responds to it. Again this is not the time to pop the big question to her. Now you let her sit on it for a week or two, disgest it ....and you do the same. If it was made and done as a way to get her back, it wasn't any real change at all, its just you doing what you can to get what you want for yourself.
After a week or so, ask her if she is willing to talk... she might be. No guarantees. The question to ask is not for her to do anything at all, but ask instead what you can and need to do for her, so there might be a chance of reconsiliation.
Stay real close to your program, your sponsor and the meetings during this time... simply because you might not hear anything you want to hear. Equallly important if you get some affirmative response from her... stay real close to your program, your sponsor and the meetings... because without them, you just turn into you again... and she don't want that back.
Not to shy away from relationships....My drinking cost me my marriage of 17 years....She gave me a choice and I drank. It also cost me my last relationship since being divorced. I think I see what the problem is now...The problem is me. I'm curious...Are you working the steps?
-- Edited by Stepchild on Thursday 31st of January 2013 01:38:33 PM
Ditto Room! "A LONG road of reconstruction lies ahead of us"!!!! L O N G road (like for the rest of our lives).....My dear Uncle, did not trust me, every time I called, that I had not yet AGAIN, planted my drunk behind upon his doorstep.....(a long leap from Chicago to San Fran)......for the first F I F T E E N YEARS of my drug-free sobriety! Yes! This is while working the steps and being a good lil A.A.! HONEY! They ( you know?...the Witnesses (lol) ) have absolutely NO REASON, to trust US or our motives! Q. How do you know a drunk is lying? A. Our lips are moving!!!! LOL! Unlikely she will believe your words! She is more likely to believe your ACTIONS....and the time frame....is in her LAP! Get a wonderful Teacher! Get through the Steps (at least once) and when you RILLY and Truly , make REAL Amends......your eyes and heart will be opened.......to what YOU have done, and what you MUST DO to begin to repair it, and you will begin to be showered in the true gifts of this thing! Keep coming back! And bless you profusely!
Wow, I wish I would have found you guys a long time ago! Nothing against my local group, I love them but you all have some fantastic advice. Everyone here is great at showing me how the program works but they seem to shy away from personal relationships (or haven't suffered similar consequences). My wife won't deny that I am a great father, she is just trying to hurt me for the hell I put them through. You are all right, and I believe my actions are speaking louder than words. Jerry, great idea of asking for a 12-step call, turning it over and getting the heck out of the way. Flowers are on the way John! I just want to be clear that I am not trying to manipulate her as I have so many times in the past. I don't want to be selfish but I still have a lot to offer my kids. Even though it hurts, it is better they come from a broken home than live in one.
(((bucknut12osu))) I have an amends to make to you - I did not intend to call you manipulative - I was referring to myself there... I was VERY manipulative and I'm throwing it out there for those who can relate - doesn't mean you... sorry : ) How soon I forget to be sensitive... so sorry.
All the best to you and your family...
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Thanks for everything. Peace and Love on your journey.
justadrunk: I know you had good intentions. When she filed for divorce, before AA I tried to manipulate her back into the relationship every way possible (begging, pleading, jealousy, guilt.....). I know now that I need to be the best father in the world and if God wills it, we will be together again!
I am just finishing up Step 4 with my sponsor, trying not to look ahead to Step 8,9. As John mentioned above, I'm trying to figure out how to make amends above and beyond "sorry". I have had a spiritual awakening but like lady eli said, when I truly make Real amends my eyes and heart will be opened (hopefully along with hers). I've heard a lot of people say they really started to feel the program during/after Step 5 so I am looking forward to that. She gave me a choice as well, along with multiple chances to quit. It is all on me. I too believe "I am right where I am supposed to be"
Lots of good stuff in this thread. What I'll add is that your sobriety is more important than the marriage, the kids, anything. If you put your sobriety first, in the prospective of "will this situation take me closer to or will it lead me away from my sobriety" (goal of long term sobriety). My concern is that if you keep pursuing the marriage, and fail (which is likely), you may blame sobriety for "not working for you". My next door neighbor, at one time, (a total drunk 63 year old living with his mom) told me "he tried AA but it didn't bring his wife back". Don't be that guy. Relationships are optional, sobriety, for an alcoholic is not. You can't force this. No mater how much you think that you're not trying to be manipulative here, you are. Sorry to be direct. I'm sure she knows how you feel, but it doesn't (and shouldn't) have any affect on the way that she feels. With that said, leave it be, go on and get a life, be happy. That's the most attractive thing you can do. Become a mature adult. Divorce isn't the end of the road or the world. If, after some more time has passed (151 days is well short of a year) this relationship may begin again, and it certainly wouldn't be the first time divorced folks got back together if it's meant to be.
-- Edited by StPeteDean on Friday 1st of February 2013 01:56:53 PM
Tasha, Acceptance will save a lot of time and pain in most situations. I should have, and will now share my E,S,&Hope. Bucknut, I tried to hang on to a marriage and stay sober for 2 years and it just didn't work. We had a 2 year old son and I was going to meetings on and off. It wasn't working. Finally I got an old timer for a sponsor. He was very profound, and a retired psychologist that had worked 20 years at the Pentagon dealing with some pretty stressed out people. Well I explained my marriage vs. sobriety situation to him and he said "you need a divorce". Of course I was angry and said "you're not my marriage counselor, you're my sponsor" and he said "you're right but that doesn't change the fact that your marriage has been over for a long time and that all that was left was the formalities". I put my sobriety first, let it go and proceeded to make a new life as a 29 year (albeit good looking lol) bachelor . Looking back, I don't see what all the crying was about. If, God forbid, it happens again, I'll welcome it.
That said, I got into a good routine of meetings, working out, hanging with some buds in the program, having a cozy relationship with my cat, movie night on wednesday, interstate motorcycle trips to see old friends, skiing, trips to the beach. My mother told me when I was tore up over the final separation that "The best revenge is living well". Trust me when I say that I've have perfected that game plan. The good news, is that there is Life after divorce, and that life is good! I was a happy bachelor for 8 years. Truth be told I dated my 2nd wife for 4 years of that time.
In hindsite, which of course is 20/20, My x-wife and I are entirely incompatible. Always were, always will be. The contrast was much easier to see once I got sober a year or two. I wouldn't go back to that for anything, and believe me I had opportunity, and I could've been cruel about it, but that's just not part of my nature.
-- Edited by StPeteDean on Friday 1st of February 2013 04:28:39 PM
If you are clear that your motives are right, then perhaps the fact that she is still pissed off could be the reason you suggest Al-Anon to her. Tell her you feel she deserves the understanding and support of some folks who have been where she is and were able to make a successful go of their lives after separating from their own alcoholic. Let her know that you know her anger is justifiable and that you feel that Al-Anon can provide some emotional support for her in all that she is about to face with the children.
Your God hates divorce but He probably also hates blackout drinking and all the emotional turmoil that can overwhelm a family after such events. Your amends to her and your babies will have to be a living amends, meaning a daily act of repentance by working the program and not going back to that lifestyle. If you truly want recovery for your wife and are not just secretly hoping for her to see your side in this and suddenly realize she should still be with you, then leave her in Gods hands.
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"And we have ceased fighting anything or anyone-even alcohol. For by this time sanity will have returned."
Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 84
An addict is WHAT I am but it does not define all of WHO I am.
Thank you SolanoGypsy. She has told me at times that she is overwhelmed by all of this but refuses (or doesn't have time) to seek support. It sounds crazy but I think she is upset I was able to go to treatment and receive the help I needed to become sober. She is a fantastic mother to our children and I truly want her and our kids to know peace. She is alone and frightened and definitely deserves the understanding and support the program offers. I pray for nothing but the best for her.
She holds all the cards as to whether I get to see my kids or not. It would be easy to move on with my life if I was 26 and there wasn't an 8, 6, and 4 year old involved. I realize it is out of my hands if the marriage is to be reconciled and I have accepted the fact it most likely will not. Knowing my sobriety comes first, do I sign away my rights to my children to keep the peace? Is wanting to see them and be an active father in their lives selfish?
She holds all the cards as to whether I get to see my kids or not. It would be easy to move on with my life if I was 26 and there wasn't an 8, 6, and 4 year old involved. I realize it is out of my hands if the marriage is to be reconciled and I have accepted the fact it most likely will not. Knowing my sobriety comes first, do I sign away my rights to my children to keep the peace? Is wanting to see them and be an active father in their lives selfish?
You ARE doing something right, right now ... In fact your top priority should be your recovery, period ... You've heard this and it is true ... There is not a problem in the world that a drink or a drug will not make worse ... It is NOT selfish to want to be a part of your kids lives, that's just natural ... But as you should well know by now, there's just some things we cannot change ... and we pray for the courage to change the things we can ... you have my prayers with you also ...
SO ... I guess the reference is to the strangle hold she has on the ole 'family jewels', huh? ... sorry man!!!
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'Those who leave everything in God's hand will eventually see God's hand in everything.'
She holds all the cards as to whether I get to see my kids or not. It would be easy to move on with my life if I was 26 and there wasn't an 8, 6, and 4 year old involved. I realize it is out of my hands if the marriage is to be reconciled and I have accepted the fact it most likely will not. Knowing my sobriety comes first, do I sign away my rights to my children to keep the peace? Is wanting to see them and be an active father in their lives selfish?
Oh now you're changing the subject . Of course being the children's father is important. I didn't abandon my 2 year olds son. I had him wednesday's and every weekend till we all moved to FL (to opposite coasts). Then I drove 5 hours (round trip) twice every other weekend to bring him to my house. I left work at noon on friday. I did this for 7.5 years, drove 125,000 wore out 3 cars, paid lots of tolls....Then my son came to live with me at age 13. One of the biggest gifts of sobriety. You have a right to visitation, it comes with the responsibility of paying child support. I hired an attorney and received Joint custody. This made a very simple mater when it came time for him to live with me. Didn't have to go to court to fight for custody, I already had it. All of this went down at about 9 months sober.
That's part of my dilemma. In Ohio, it takes a hell of a lot to change the courts decision when the divorce is final (basically, she needs to have a change of heart). Do I accept visitation as it is or keep fighting for shared parenting? I run the risk of spending a ton of money and possibly never having 'joint custody' I still have a lot to offer them. She knows I am a good father but is blinded by anger at the moment. I respect your dedication to your son Dean and I would do the same for mine. I just need to check myself for self-seeking.
Dear Lil Bucky Noobie ;)!!!! All of the impossible problems, of early sobriety ( and all of my sobriety ), were & are, solved FOR me....with Sobriety, A.A. & the 12 Steps FIRST! Solutions arose, and arise, in ways that are proof to me ........"We will suddenly realize that God is doing for us what we could never do for ourselves"!!!!! And the solutions never seem to come to me, in the ordinary ways......you know, weighing the pros and cons, wracking my brain, thinking thinking thinking of the problem.............I learned to pray, surrender, show-up, surrender, pray........and it FEELS like EVERYTHING is being solved FOR me!!!! Not in the ways, I envision........ie; the whole marrying Johnny Depp and winning the lotto, being a movie star/musician/president ways XD!.....but.....in the ways......that have given me a sober life, filled with purpose, love and hope! Your children , I believe, will be in your life, when you are ready, and when you can SERVE THEM!!! Promise! Now.......not to stomp any toes (like your Teachers) but I ALWAYS suggest...to new people....the first time through the 9th Step.....(and any time we need a reality check)....go to many Alanon meetings....do NOT SPEAK!!!! I REPEAT: DO NOT SPEAK (us sick drunks tend to monopolize, the poor Alanons) !!!!!!! One more time, " DO NOT SPEAK"!!!! Do NOT introduce yourself as an "alcoholic".....S T F U!!!! and LISTEN......and when the resistance shows up in your heart.....PRAY to HEAR!!!!! The "resistance" tends to feel like anger," NUH-UH!!!! Nope, thats not MEEEEE!!!!!" Just pray to HEAR! Blessings upon you! with love, Lady Eli
. Looking back, I don't see what all the crying was about. If, God forbid, it happens again, I'll welcome it. 
