Why I don't attend many meetings anymore - I'm disgusted with hearing people repeat the same bullshit over and over again, whether it be some cliche that they think makes them sound important, such as: "Meeting makers make it." (Make what?) Or the standard rehab-ese psychobabble, such as: "I'm workin' a selfish program..." (According to the Big Book, we must rid ourselves of selfishness, or it kills us.) Or just things some people say that just irk me, such as: "Well, when I came into the program..." (The program is in the book. What you are in is a fellowship of men and women, who share their experience, strength, and hope with one another.)
I've been told that I have anger issues, I don't dispute that.
I don't have any desire whatsoever to go to a meeting where people say a bunch of bullshit, half-truths, meaningless cliches, and other crap which could potentially harm others (especially impressionable newcomers) by misleading them. I don't want to hear you "share where you're at..." I don't want to hear you whine about your day, or your ex, or your kids, or your boss, etc. To me that's not recovery. I don't need to learn new ways to be a selfish XXX and XXX my life up, I already know how to do that. I don't need to hear about your higher power that you choose to call Joe, either. If that's what works for you, fine, more power to you, but I don't need some evangelist trying to convert me to their way. ...And, I don't need meetings to keep me sober. (I know some folks will balk at that, but it's true.) I have not had a drink of alcohol in over eight years, and I'm not bragging about that, simply stating fact. Meetings don't keep a person sober. That's what we have steps for. ...Now, my higher power, whom I choose to call the Great Mystery, is putting it in my heart to stop being so critical of others if my true intent is to help them.
Ok. We live in a self-centered society, a consumer-society. Selfishness is promoted, because selfishness sells product, which equals profit. "Me, me, me, the universe revolves around me!" is a hard habit to overcome. My sponsor suggested to me that I do anonymous good deeds, random acts of kindness, without recognition, because claiming the action, accepting credit for it, would take away from the inherent goodness of it. It helped. I'm still human, and therefore selfish by nature, but not so much as I used to be. (By the way, one does not necessarilly have to be 'nice' in order to be kind.) I'm not a nice person, I'm rude, crass, arrogant, and sometimes nasty-tempered. (& I tend to cuss a lot.) I grew up running the streets and fighting. I've worked construction and mechanical jobs most of my adult life, and I don't have good people-skills. I was a mean, nasty drunk, never a "social" drinker. Part of the reason I don't attend very many meetings is because I don't want to get angry in the meeting and hold forth about the things that piss me off. That wouldn't help anyone, including me. - That's why I'm glad that this forum is here, you've provided me a place to rant without getting hostile in public. Thanx. :)
-- Edited by Rob84 on Thursday 29th of November 2012 10:46:55 PM
I never gave my HP a name but if I ever do Joe might make the shortlist. Sharp and snappy, and will keep people guessing when I say with an air of mystery: "I'll have to ask Joe what he thinks and get back to you".
Why I don't attend many meetings anymore - I'm disgusted with hearing people repeat the same bullshit over and over again, whether it be some cliche that they think makes them sound important, such as: "Meeting makers make it." (Make what?) Or the standard rehab-ese psychobabble, such as: "I'm workin' a selfish program..." (According to the Big Book, we must rid ourselves of selfishness, or it kills us.) Or just things some people say that just irk me, such as: "Well, when I came into the program..." (The program is in the book. What you are in is a fellowship of men and women, who share their experience, strength, and hope with one another.)
I've been told that I have anger issues, I don't dispute that.
I don't have any desire whatsoever to go to a meeting where people say a bunch of bullshit, half-truths, meaningless cliches, and other crap which could potentially harm others (especially impressionable newcomers) by misleading them. I don't want to hear you "share where you're at..." I don't want to hear you whine about your day, or your ex, or your kids, or your boss, etc. To me that's not recovery. I don't need to learn new ways to be a selfish XXX and XXX my life up, I already know how to do that. I don't need to hear about your higher power that you choose to call Joe, either. If that's what works for you, fine, more power to you, but I don't need some evangelist trying to convert me to their way. ...And, I don't need meetings to keep me sober. (I know some folks will balk at that, but it's true.) I have not had a drink of alcohol in over eight years, and I'm not bragging about that, simply stating fact. Meetings don't keep a person sober. That's what we have steps for. ...Now, my higher power, whom I choose to call the Great Mystery, is putting it in my heart to stop being so critical of others if my true intent is to help them.
Ok. We live in a self-centered society, a consumer-society. Selfishness is promoted, because selfishness sells product, which equals profit. "Me, me, me, the universe revolves around me!" is a hard habit to overcome. My sponsor suggested to me that I do anonymous good deeds, random acts of kindness, without recognition, because claiming the action, accepting credit for it, would take away from the inherent goodness of it. It helped. I'm still human, and therefore selfish by nature, but not so much as I used to be. (By the way, one does not necessarilly have to be 'nice' in order to be kind.) I'm not a nice person, I'm rude, crass, arrogant, and sometimes nasty-tempered. (& I tend to cuss a lot.) I grew up running the streets and fighting. I've worked construction and mechanical jobs most of my adult life, and I don't have good people-skills. I was a mean, nasty drunk, never a "social" drinker. Part of the reason I don't attend very many meetings is because I don't want to get angry in the meeting and hold forth about the things that piss me off. That wouldn't help anyone, including me. - That's why I'm glad that this forum is here, you've provided me a place to rant without getting hostile in public. Thanx. :)
-- Edited by Rob84 on Thursday 29th of November 2012 10:46:55 PM
I went to a lot of my early meetings in the steel-mill areas of Cleveland, some "rough around the edges" characters, glad they where there for me when I came in.
I like what you said about selfishness....it does seem like society pushes it, but it is the root of our sickness. Hope you stick around and offer ESH here.
"Now, my higher power, whom I choose to call the Great Mystery, is putting it in my heart to stop being so critical of others if my true intent is to help them."
Yes, it's in the book, "love and tolerance is our code".
PG 89 Practical experience shows that nothing will so much insure immunity from drinking as intensive work with other alcoholics
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Rob
"There ain't no Coupe DeVille hiding in the bottom of a Cracker Jack Box."
Hi spiritbear. Welcome. I sometimes avoid meetings when there are people I don't like at them. People who cling to resentments and make up crap to purposely annoy you.
No cursing is not specifically a "rule," But it is something edited on the boards frequently. I was just on the alanon board and Hotrod (the 60some year old lady that moderates that board along with a few others) edited the word "C##t" to look just like that. Hence, I know it's universal. So, I had to chime in an stop the spread of misinformation.
Tanin, perhaps you would like to go over to the alanon board and pick arguments with those moderators too. Or perhaps there is something about just me.
Im thinking I can guess what it is.
**I edited - A thought that may be valid, but one I should have kept to myself.
-- Edited by pinkchip on Friday 30th of November 2012 10:20:53 PM
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You are right Fyne Spirit (Mike). I mis-spoke. When I am annoyed with others, I try and remember we are not all well (especially me). For the most part, I am constantly amazed by how far others have come and even what the program has done for me.
I would not agree with the concept of "recovered" as I think it's a journey that is ongoing and I am always in recovery. I am so far from perfect....While I don't run to the bottle and have the same glaring dysfunction that I did when drinking, I'm still sick occassionally from spiritual disconnectedness and my ego flaring up and getting in my own way and whatever my HP wants for me. Probably this is actually occurring to me today LOL.
So I do kind of think we are all sick - but on the flip side, we are all WAY better living in the solution. Just my take.
-- Edited by pinkchip on Friday 30th of November 2012 01:56:11 PM
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
Hi SpirtBear...I can't always go to a meeting, but I sure miss the laughter and getting my daily neck exercises! I get to go tomorrow and I am excited and looking forward to it. I was an angry drunk too...but they loved me through it and so I love them through it too.
Also, spiritbear, While there are some very sick people in AA, the great majority mean well and are nice - even when they say cliche and annoying things. We are all just sick folks leaning on each other for help basically. That helps me be accepting in almost all circumstances, except when I come across people who are purposely hurtful and nasty like I seem to be encountering lately. I hope you post more. I didn't view your post as a rant - I've had some of those same exact thoughts after several years of meetings. The come and go. Many times it's me going "When I came into the program...." but occassionally someone comes up and says "Your share really helped me" and I know that I was helped by others saying those things when I was new...So...I just keep doing what I do and people can take it or leave it.
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
Just for the record, I love going to meetings ... even after years of doing so ... the meetings saved my life and has done so for a lot of folks ... I will continue to go and search for ways to be of help to new-comers ... that's how the program works, as I see it ...
Pappy
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'Those who leave everything in God's hand will eventually see God's hand in everything.'
Welcome SB, I get your point about some meetings though we don't seem to get the same extremes here. We had one the other night with about 15 in attendance and nine newcomers from a Maori treatment program. We had a 20 plus year guy talk for 20 minutes about his mistreatment at the hands of our local health system to do with some medical problems. Don't quite know what hope the newcomers could draw from that.
I just want to challenge PC on something. I think it is not true to say we are all sick people leaning on each other. What hope does that offer? I think it's nearer the truth to say AA is a bunch of recovered alcoholics trying to show others precisely how we recovered. That's what the Book says, though not all parts of the fellowship of AA practice the practice the program of AA. My experience is that if we follow the directions in the basic text, we will recover just as the first 100 did.
Wow!! best display of fear I've seen today and earlier on I was thinking I cleared the highest mark myself. Welcome to the board SB and Mahalo (thanks) for bringing back a repeat of an old "it's their fault" bitch I still hear from time to time and think I invented at the start to stay away from all of the A..h.les I met before entering the rooms for just the one person your HP is trying to get you to focus on...myself. I had a hard go of it. I have the same background as you have and my pride and ego also convinced me because I was such a noted streeted fighter I had a supreme right to lofty position mentally only and not spiritually ever. How another person wears and walks their own program is their choice...we all have the same amount of time, ability and facility (AA) to get it better if not righter. Bless them for who and where they are at. They don't rent space in my spirit and head and I don't allow any of them to have power over my emotions and spirit. It is what it is...cliche? and then it's gone. Next?
When I first got to AA...(outside the door for quite awhile) it was really dangerous for a convinced member to try to go face to face with me...trying to convince me of their crap. It was dangerous because I was fear based and didn't have booze to temper the fear anymore. I was angry and rageful and that was of no value to my necessary understanding and awareness and I was threatening the fellowship to stay the hell out of my way. It worked of course and I got to carry more of the insanity of the disease without the chemical or the program. I was all alone without anything...good, bad, indifferent. Somewhere along this journey of attempting to stay alcohol free and sober at the same time some old timer referred me to Page 449 of the Big Book 3rd Edition. I can almost bet you know that one by heart since you refer to the Big Book as "thee" sources. If it somewhat skips your memory go take a review of what Dr. Paul says there and see if it tempers your vision and opinion of "them" and their short comings. It has mine and I'll end this with if it hadn't been for those Axx Hxles sticking around until my process (program) came by their chairs by HP's design again, I would have never had the priviledge of reading your share. I thought I was unique...and then when I get that thought if I listen closely my Higher Power...Akua...Laughs
Keep coming back
-- Edited by Jerry F on Saturday 1st of December 2012 01:00:00 AM
I don't get to many meeting much anymore either. Not because I don't like them, it's breaches of my crazy work schedule. It makes it tough to get involved and take commitments. Yup, AA can be crazy at times, the people messed up, and sometimes general mayhem.
I choose to stay and enjoy out. It's a lot less insane that the jails, nut houses, rehabs, and the insanity I had to put up with when I was in the middle of my addiction.
Sure, I can practice all but the 12th step on my own. For that I have to be where those still suffering are likely to be found. I can't work all 12 steps unless I'm working all 12 steps.
I think there's an invisible principle of living...if we believe we're guided through every step of our lives, we are. Its a lovely sight, watching it work.
Just don't get caught
