That, my dear, is a perfect example of ... NOT putting principles before personalities ... as is stated we should do in the 12th Tradition ... Just keep in mind ... Long sobriety times do not always mean a person has changed ... or even that they actively practice the program ... these guys are all over the place ... and usually easy to spot ... don't let these types bother you in the least ... they still have a lot of 'growing up' to do ...
Pappy
Sorry, I just saw the part about advice from the ladies ... LOL ... well, you got my take on it for free ...
-- Edited by Pythonpappy on Friday 15th of June 2012 06:48:22 PM
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'Those who leave everything in God's hand will eventually see God's hand in everything.'
Hey guys:) sorry to dominate forum last couple of days..have a lot going on in my head and still trying to figure the aa thing out. So today I went to a meeting, and was feeling pretty good as it is 30 days sober for me. The meeting was mostly men, which is fine..I'm generally comfortable around men..have 3 brothers. Most of the guys were old timers and complete gentlemen. One guy, however, was really quite rude, asking me all kinds of questions and scoffing at my 30 days and questioning the validity of my "bottom"..telling me "next time" I try to get sober will be more difficult. He pretty much completely dismissed me and spoke to me like I was a dumb kid. Now I'm 36, so I'm not really a kid, and he was around my age. It was just bizarre and rude and disheartening. This is the 2nd experience I've had like this in aa. I've tried to just brush it off but it's really bothered me all day. Am I unknowingly breaching some unspoken etiquette of aa by being friendly with the guys? Let me be clear that I am in noooo way flirting.
Have you been to women-only meetings? At my first meeting (co-ed), I was immediately surrounded by a bubble of women who told me, "Go to a women's meeting. Here's the time and place." And women's meeting are different. I do need both type of meetings in my program.
The only men who spoke to me at first were old Old Timers (as in, decades of sobriety and old enough to be my father). And all of them have spoken to me with respect.
I have had one old Old Timer tell me that I only needed to be in AA for a year. He has since changed his tune as I've begun to tell more of my story. He was the first to say "Wow, that's a long time" when I finally shared how long I've been drinking alcoholically.
The only men my age who have spoken to me are the ones with little or no sobriety: I duck out of those conversations quickly.
I take what I like and leave the rest. I listen to the people with decades of recovery. I follow them and go to the meetings they go to.
Do you have a sponsor? This might be something you want to run by her.
Some are sicker than others. But I do try to stick to womens meetings, sometimes "co-Ed" meets actuallyend up being sausage fests. Your not the only woman to have had this issue. This is why womens meetings exist :)
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sober: showing no excessive or extreme qualities of fancy, emotion, or prejudice
It's great you're asking and talking about it... shows you care about your recovery. Keep up the good work! Let nothing, and NO ONE stand in the way of your sobriety!
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Thanks for everything. Peace and Love on your journey.
Flirting? No one is suggesting that Colleen, at least not here. You might be new to A.A. dear, but you're not new to the world. There will be instances where people act discourteous or impolite, kind of like today. It's just the way of the world dear, that's all. It should in no way take away from the overall message, in its entirety. A.A. is many things to many people, but it doesn't instill negativity or disdain in any part of the preamble, does it Colleen? People are just that dear, people. And some act more grown up than others. That's a part of sobriety that I don't care for personally, even though it does exist. What I try to focus on instead are the positives Colleen; that and the stories. And boy, do I love the stories. They're the glue that binds our lives together, thank God. So stick to the game plan dear, and never stop questioning A.A.'s motives or recovery in general, okay. Stay focused, keep connected and never give up hope. We won't, either should you.
The rooms of AA are filled with people who have been sick for a long long Time. Some are getting better, some just bask in the filth they have lived in all there lives. Some hang around because we are the only ones who will have them. There are also a whole lot of real good people who try one day at a time to walk with and seek God. Then there are the pieces of human sewage sexual predators who lurk around looking to inflict them selves on anyone they can. Stick with the winners. Grow a thick skin, if your gonna stick around AA, your gonna need it. AA is an awesome deal. When our perception starts to change, we learn compassion for a lot of those people. But not for the predators.
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Since it cost a lot to win, and even more to loose, you and me gotta spend some time just wondering what to choose.
It's a daily reflection that I heard in rehab. If you are an orange then there is no point trying to be an apple. You can only be an orange. I'm an alcoholic. I can't be a normal person. Trying to live that way will kill me. So I have to accept what I am, make the best of that and be the best at it that I can be.
It's a little reminder to me to never forget that who I am demands that my sobriety comes first in all things.
Thanks Frodo ... ... ... I too, pondered this for a long time ... ... after careful consideration, I had guessed, quite accurately, as it turns out, that is what the meaning was ... My thought was it was a practice in accepting who you are, so make the best of it ...
Thanks,
Pappy
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'Those who leave everything in God's hand will eventually see God's hand in everything.'
I remember being proud of my milestones in earlier recovery and there would be some comments thrown my way to humble me back down. It wasn't always meant to be degrading, but I experienced it that way sometimes. I just was talking to my grandsponsor a couple of days ago and I made a comment about how I don't go to the clubhouse I used to go all the time in my first year of sobriety and how I don't feel like going and it doesn't seem as necessary to go to meetings at the clubhouse as opposed to elsewhere now like it used to be back then in my first year. Here is the general response I got:
"Stop talking like you GOT this program. You ain't got shit and you aren't too good for the clubhouse."
That would have had me in tears in my first year. Okay - now I know that is just one of the precious gems that come out of my cranky grandsponsor's mouth and at least he has enough respect for me to not coddle me and break it down and tell it like it is.
I'm not sure if the interaction you had with that guy was sort of like the one I had with my grandsponsor or if it was really a demeaning and skeezy type of interaction. I try and find the value of what people say to me in AA. I talked a lot during my first year and there was an undercurrent of "In the old days we used to tell people who were new like you to sit down and shut up." I also heard from some oldtimers "Newcomers need to take the cotton out of their ears and stick it in their mouths." Okay - well those were not things I wanted to hear but sometimes those statements did apply to me and sometimes they still do. My grandsponsor does have the wisdom to school me like that with 34 years sobriety. To him, my big bad "3 years" is STILL very early sobriety.
So - it will be your task to figure out whether comments are meant to help you vs. hurt you, if they are demeaning vs. humbling, and whether sexual motives are involved or not (as a female). I attend mostly gay meetings with other gay men so that is actually something I have had to focus on too. Technically, I cannot be 13th stepped anymore but there are still guys with 20 years and more that I sometimes instinctively feel are talking to me for other reasons than that they want to impart knowledge to me.
If you don't have a female sponsor yet, I hope you get one soon and run all your thoughts and experiences by her. I recall calling mine all upset and offended by something someone said to me in early meetings and my sponsor would be able to break it down and clear it up for me very simply.
Mostly, just keep up the good work and don't be deterred.
In support,
Mark
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
Thanks for all the feedback..especially mark. I get what you said about just listening at meeting at this point, and I do just that..I've yet to speak during a meeting. These guys approach me after the meeting, and I guess there are jerks everywhere haha. Sponser advised me to go straight to the women after meetings so I don't look like a "target" haha. Thanks again
Aloha Col...I relate from experience with what Polly responded with. When I was new in recovery and in the other room; Al-Anon, the meetings after the meetings at coffee houses usually included a ton of AAs from down the hall and cripes they use to drive me crazy with their personal crap (it was all personal). The Al-Anon slogan "take what you like and leave the rest" helped a ton and I was able to blow off much of the early recovery know it alls and maintain my serenity. When I didn't blow it all of I was threatening to blow them all away to get them out of my face. Finally I arrived at the awareness that the programs, especially at the start seem to highlight all of the negative fantasy of recovery and not the reality of it. My sponsor hung with me and sorted the jibberish out lots of times.
Hope you find what you need from the person you most need it from. ((((hugs))))
