Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude.
Concerning the Big Book, Clarence S. told his wife Grace about a weekend trip Bill Wilson made toAkron,Ohio, to visit Dr. Bob shortly before Dr. Bob passed on.
Year after year and like a drip from a squeaky faucet Bill was insisting, cajoling in a persistent connivance to get Dr. Bob to endorse, agree and set his hand of signature to seal a unified launch of the Twelve Traditions. Dr. Bob the consummate Vermont Yankee with hands the size of diner plates held fast to his objection that the Traditions were written to park power in the central New York headoffice tower of the fledgling A.A.
Dr. Bob called Clarence S for logistical as well as moral support. Clarence came on the run fromClevelandto join Dr. Bob, while Bill made his way for yet another joust at agreement, while sliding down from the Big Apple and landing inAkronOhio.
Bill W. was prepared, documents handily at the ready, as he employed his most ardent and considerable power of persuasion. Clarence recounts Bills impassioned plea Doc, youve got to sign these so I can add these to the Big Book. Dr. Bob in a final and futile effort mustered up his last objection in a conciliatory tone Bill, we have no need for what you call the Twelve Traditions. Our program came from the New Testament. We have the Bible. We have the Four Absolutes. We have the Steps from the Oxford Group, Weve got the program. We just need to teach it as it is. As a man on a mission with his goal within grasp, Bill sensed Dr. Bobs resolve starting to lapse. Bill redoubled his efforts with the insistence of a knight in search of the Holy Grail and repeated what he had already said Doc, youve got to do it!Clarence said Dr. Bob was exasperated and silence hung heavy in the air until the exhale of resignation could be heard by the deaf, as if it had been written in brail. Dr. Bob in the unbelief of defeat had opted for serenity and said All right. Give them to me; Ive got to have some peace.
Clarence witnessed the signing and shortly thereafter the Twelve Traditions were voted in by A.A.
Today the brick and mortar of A.A. remain the Twelve Traditions, it keeps us whole accountable and in service. My experience is that unfortunately there are misconstrued, misused and convoluted as to original intent of application. They are often times taken in a piece meal bites while they are interpreted as laws and worse than that often times than not some insist on the letter that brings death, and not the spirit that gives life. Dr. Bobs misgivings have taken a ghostly form and have given scope of authority where none belong, as well as Bills original and correct intent remains clean and pure. I pray I am up to the task and will give only verifiable history and my own personal Experience, Strength in a hope to repair the breach.
Sounds more like gaseous clouds around uranus than anything else. It says in the AA preamble, that we should not engage in controversy. So, why do you insist on doing so?
Most ideas are first met with ridicule, and then violent opposition and when the violent opposition passes away acceptance.
To answer you querie its my experience and for good or for ill it gives folks an opportunity to examine the existing text for conformation of direction. The other fact you might not be aware is that A.A. as a whole has been loosing ground I believe this is part of it . I will come under attack for raising the flag as that is not my intent, its sort of a bonus, when a nerve is pricked it raises ire as well as the concousness to think.
Joseph I'm with you on this one all the way, every single thing we have gained in this fellowship has been gained under controversy and conflict, a quick read through those very traditions and the stories behind them, especially Tradition three bears this out, Sponsorship as we know it today wasn't developed by Bob or Bill, but by Clarence, and he fought tooth and nail to "get his way" and he did so by producing results FAR surpassing anywhere else, so much so that many think AA originated in Cleveland, AA -exploded- under his new "sponsorship" idea, and it post dated the writing of the Big Book, but he originated the concept that the Big Book was all we needed, so something we spout as gospel was founded in conflict, another is:
I was in Hospitals and Institutions for many years, that brings meetings into hospitals, mental institutions, jails, and prisons, the second oldest "subset" of AA, second only to The General Service Board, and although we take it for granted today as being part of AA, it was concieved in a storm of controversy and born in a fist-fight in the parking lot of San Quentin Prison when AA's from New York flew out to stop Marin AA's from taking a meeting into the prison per a request from the Warden, My friend Dick B was there, I heard him tell the story many times, he was a contemporary of Bill and Bob, he unfortunately passed a few weeks ago actually, severing the last local connection we had to the forming of AA, now that Dr Gil and Irv have passed, these men told these stories of AA clubs, fistfights, and the incredible growing pains of AA, Clarence's, Dr Bill and The Good Old Timers, and the 12 and 12 also tell these stories, I mean we came within a hair of not allowing women in the program when AA #7 was caught banging AA #9 on Bobs examination table (numbers are approximate, but they were both in the first ten)
Thats why God invented the minority opinion and the group conscience, and thats why today AA'ers and their groups are allowed "the right to be wrong", AA has the same rights God gave us, free will and stupidity with a little guidance, secure in the knowledge that stupidity = death, Darwinism at it's finest and there will always be resistance to change and resistance for things to stay the same, and this being AA, will always be ready with a coffee pot and a resentment to start their own meeting where THEY will have "the right to be wrong" in their own fashion
There is "controversy" in this thread, just not in the first post IMO, that is just a simple statement of fact and affirmation of AA's message
-- Edited by LinBaba on Tuesday 21st of June 2011 03:49:38 PM
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
You know your A.A. history more than most ,if I was a drinking man I would propose a toast ,oh I am a drinking man I can raise my hand without a glass. I have been in contact with Dick B he is not dead he is only in Hawaii. Perhaps you can would consider helping as I go over the intent and purpose of the Traditons and how in some circumstance a group of drunks have mucked them up and get back to the understanding that Bill first layed out, for after all is said and done it was and is God that remains in charge.
You know your A.A. history more than most ,if I was a drinking man I would propose a toast ,oh I am a drinking man I can raise my hand without a glass. I have been in contact with Dick B he is not dead he is only in Hawaii. Perhaps you can would consider helping as I go over the intent and purpose of the Traditons and how in some circumstance a group of drunks have mucked them up and get back to the understanding that Bill first layed out, for after all is said and done it was and is God that remains in charge.
Thanks for the writings Boys!! very interesting and informative,always try and remain teachable,has kept me away from refunding my misery for a minute now....peace...
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Selfishness-self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles.
I appreciate AA history and enjoy the "backstories" people post here--especially when the source is cited (i.e. Dick B's book) so I can dig deeper if I want. Dunno, Mr. David, what's stuck in your craw about gezepe's post...I don't see anything in it that I can relate to your comments????
MikeF...wow, look at da baybee :) 2 cute, "gramps"
qreat thread, thanks. We had an old timer here in St. Pete by the name of "Kansas city Bob". I attended his 55th anniversary, about 10 years aqo. He was 83 and if my math is correct, qot sober at 28 years of aqe, in 1946. I'm not sure if he is still with us. He spoke at his anniversary and told a the story of his path into AA. It was suqqested to him, by his boss that he try AA. He was qiven direction to an AA club that met on tuesday niqht. He went there on thursday, by mistake. He knocked on the door and the doorman answered sternly "What do you want?". Bob answered "I'm lookinq for the AA meetinq". The man at the door barked "Come back on Tuesday" and slammed the door. Turned out the AA club, in order to pay the rent, leased the space out to a speak easy/casino 4 niqhts a week.
When Bob joined this qroup he had to siqn some papers qivinq his name, address, phone number, place of work, and favorite bar. If a member missed a couple of meetinqs, members of the qroup would qo lookinq for the missinq member at home, and then his bar to reclaim him. When Bill W. qot wind of this, he made a special trip to the AA club to lecture them to persuade them to qive up these practices. Kansas City Bob was at that meetinq when Bill W spoke, and said he was adamant and his tone was stronq. There was some arqument from the qroup, but the practices ceased.
qreat thread, thanks. We had an old timer here in St. Pete by the name of "Kansas city Bob". I attended his 55th anniversary, about 10 years aqo. He was 83 and if my math is correct, qot sober at 28 years of aqe, in 1946. I'm not sure if he is still with us. He spoke at his anniversary and told a the story of his path into AA. It was suqqested to him, by his boss that he try AA. He was qiven direction to an AA club that met on tuesday niqht. He went there on thursday, by mistake. He knocked on the door and the doorman answered sternly "What do you want?". Bob answered "I'm lookinq for the AA meetinq". The man at the door barked "Come back on Tuesday" and slammed the door. Turned out the AA club, in order to pay the rent, leased the space out to a speak easy/casino 4 niqhts a week.
When Bob joined this qroup he had to siqn some papers qivinq his name, address, phone number, place of work, and favorite bar. If a member missed a couple of meetinqs, members of the qroup would qo lookinq for the missinq member at home, and then his bar to reclaim him. When Bill W. qot wind of this, he made a special trip to the AA club to lecture them to persuade them to qive up these practices. Kansas City Bob was at that meetinq when Bill W spoke, and said he was adamant and his tone was stronq. There was some arqument from the qroup, but the practices ceased.
lol, like it.
Off topic (sorry) -- not sure that this was an early days thing or not (probably not) but there were some famous, now departed, guys in AA in London who would go around rounding up street drunks, putting them into the back of van and taking them to meetings! The members had great nicknames too -- it seems like everyone of a certain time in AA in England either knew these guys or knew of them.
