Hello I'm Ron and am fairly new to this, have been to few meetings but never go back...my son Griffin turns 3 tomorrow and I have made a promise to myself to stop drinking.
I want to become a sober father, for him to look up to me.
If you are a hard drinker, you will absolutely be able to quit and we will be here for you every step of the way, although it may be troublesome in the beginning
If you are an alcoholic, I have bad news for you, getting sober for your son is not going to work, not long term, the day will come, probably sooner then later when all your will power, all your strength, all your good character will count for nought, it will be a special occasion or a sunny day, you will be in a good mood or a bad mood, but you will be unable to remember with sufficient clarity why you shouldn't drink, that is why alcoholism is classified as a disease, and not merely "weak willed" or a lack of character, it's an obsession of the mind coupled with an allergy of the body, the mind doesn't remember, tells us it's OK to have a drink, we put one in our system, then we can't stop
For alcoholics, we have the strongest wills in the world, look at most famous people, famous artists, great statesmen, alcoholics, all of them...it's just will power and strength don't work with this deal, tens and hundreds of millions of alcoholics throughout history have proven that beyond a doubt, including every single person on this forum, now you are going to test that theory
If your strength fails, and if you are an alcoholic it will, and sobriety for it's own sake becomes the single most important thing in the world to you, go try another meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous, my experience is they get a hellova lot more interesting when I am ready to finally hang up my hat, before I'm ready I hated everyone there and needed to go drink after the meeting after being surrounded by such losers and idiots, strangely enough, after I surrendered to the fact that what I was doing wasn't working no matter how hard I tried, these same people seemed kind and intelligent, and they all had something in common
They knew how to get and stay sober and I didn't
Look me up if it doesn't work out for you, stick around the board, read about what every single person with long term sobriety did that every single person that keeps relapsing didn't do, and if your sobriety and your son and keeping your word are REALLY that important to you, maybe you will take that action too, if you fail however, don't beat yourself up, alcohol has taken out bigger men then you and I, surrender, which means "come over to the winning side", we'll leave the light on for you
-- Edited by LinBaba on Thursday 2nd of June 2011 10:25:52 PM
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
Aloha Ron...Welcome to MIP and the front door to sobriety if you need it bad enough. I read your Bio and it reminded me of "intentions" and brought back up the voice and lesson of my elder sponsor. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions".
Like LinBaba I'm in support of you and also of your son while you attempt to get what we have for today. I've never met another alcoholic who used the description "easy" when describing alcohol free, sober living. Alcoholism is an awesomely cunning, powerful and baffling disease and without the unconditional willingness and the ability to be totally honest it will not let you rest from doing what it is that you don't want to do again. I drank because it was there and while it was there and I was there I drank until it wasn't there anymore and there wasn't anymore there. Once I began I felt I was supposed to continue to drink on purpose. I didn't have a problem (to me) with alcohol so I had nothing to prove to my children by stopping. That kind of feeling of responsibility could not and did not work for me or my addict wife and the children were deeply affected by it. Alcoholism is a progressive disease and not only does it get progressively worse for the alcoholic drinker it progresses over into the family.
It will be a miracle for your son to be able to look to his Father as a mentor a healthy mentor one who can practice on a daily basis living a healthy mind, body, spirit and emotional life. That is the best I feel we can give the family and others and of all the programs I entered and practiced which mirrored that positive life style back to my children the spiritual 12step fellowship of AA and the Al-Anon Family Groups were the only ones and worked best and often.
I never came into AA with a Rah Rah attitude. As Lin mentioned I came in self centered to the extreem and very fearful which showed up in my oppositional defiance to the program and anything new which made me think I need help from "them". I hated "them" and when "they" approached me with "their" spiel I would ignore or threaten them away. One of my early lessons was to kill my ego and crush my pride and that lesson took a long time and is still being redone on a daily basis.
I pray you don't get fixed on trying to do this thing called recovery on your own. You have not been very successful "on your own" up till now and you're worried about it ever working in the future. I suggest you go back to "them" and sit with "them" with an open mind and listen to "their" what it was like, what happened and what is like now for "them". If you want what "they" have, turn yourself over to this program that works best for most and surrender yourself to God as you understand God (someone bigger than Ron) and come join us.
I have told my grandkids that if they ever need help with the compulsion to drink and use drugs I can place them in the midst of thousands of fellows who can help them change that process for the better. You might have to tell your son that some day. Keep coming back to MIP and help us gain and maintain our own sobriety. (((hugs)))
Thank you both for your words of wisdom and encouragement...it will be and has been a struggle, difficult and painful...I drink to mask the hurt, emptiness and loneliness. I drink alone, 'to cut the edge off' sometimes out of boredom and restlessness, thinking no one knows, they do...feeling helpless...worried. I will go to a meeting again. I am weary of my destructive behavior and I desperately want a way out, to be free. To live.
-- Edited by Mysonturns3 on Friday 3rd of June 2011 12:07:09 AM
Good decision Ron...If you want it...really want it and it becomes your singleness of purpose you will do what is suggested that you do. If you don't have sobriety you will have nothing and your son will not have a dad...You already know this so...Go to your first meeting and get a Big Book if you don't have one already. Get phone numbers from the fellowship to call in between meetings. Say something like "Hi this is Ron from AA and I got your phone number in the meeting and I have a question...then ask a question about staying sober in AA. If the person isn't clear enough as them if they can expand on the solution for them." It is what I did and I had no shame or embarrasment about doing that. I either did or I didn't get to meet you and the rest of this fellowship who has supported me in staying sober and serene. Remember also...and practice this...Keep coming back.
Mysonturns3 wrote:I am weary of my destructive behavior and I desperately want a way out, to be free. To live.
This resonated with me, this was truth
When I got to your place, the stepping off place I abandoned myself to AA with the desperation of a dying man, I took what I liked and left the rest until I met my sponsor, then I took what he gave me
That book is a textbook of alcoholism and how to recover from it, and it's not a painless process but we end up happier people, different people, we end up people who don't have to drink any more, and we go to meetings and laugh when we shoud cry, and cry when we should laugh..
...and then my wife left me (the room is ROLLING in stitches.....)
....and then my son hugged me and said "I love you daddy" (and there isn't a dry eye in the house)
go earn your story until you get to the part where you are the one in front of the room talking about what it was like to teach your son how to ride a bike sober, watch him graduate high school and then college sober, and then get married and have your grandson, who you get to hold when HE is just moments old....because you are sober
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
Thanks everyone, I'm home from work on a Friday, Day 4. I feel restless but in control I want a cold beer, but I don't, I want to make it to day 5.
My son Griffin, is with his mom tonight celebrating his birthday, I'll see him tomorrow after work. I'm usually a little tipsy when I pick him up, vodka and powerade. Then I usually go to my mom's and while he is playing with her I'm chugging down 2 beers in the shower. He sometimes asks, "daddy are you OK?". I'm not OK. I want to be OK.
I find Going to bed early is helping as well as keeping my mind occupied and distracted.
I'll make it. I'm going to a meeting on tuesday
-- Edited by Mysonturns3 on Friday 3rd of June 2011 07:36:10 PM
Welcome Ron. Just get to that first meeting and ask for help. The rest will be spelled out of you there. Literature states we were all at a turning point and it sounds like you may really be at yours. Keep coming back and let us know how the meeting goes.
-- Edited by pinkchip on Saturday 4th of June 2011 12:12:43 AM
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
Day 5...withdrawals, I miss the burn in my mouth from alcohol, the first drink is always the best, ahhh...then begins the downward spiral... It feels good to go to bed knowing I had a sober day, realizing it wasn't so bad. I made it through another day, who knows what tomorrow holds...as I rebuild my life. Step by step, day by day... Sobriety is my highest priority right now.
Day 5...withdrawals, I miss the burn in my mouth from alcohol, the first drink is always the best, ahhh...then begins the downward spiral... It feels good to go to bed knowing I had a sober day, realizing it wasn't so bad. I made it through another day, who knows what tomorrow holds...as I rebuild my life. Step by step, day by day... Sobriety is my highest priority right now.
A friend of mine wrote the following passage in italics awhile back, and it made sense to me, possibly soon it will make sense to you, for alcoholics we can white knuckle it for awhile, but there are a few qualities that make us alcoholics, one is "Life without alcohol slowly becomes unbearable" and one of two things goes into our mouths, a drink or a gun, that is the nature of alcoholism it's cunning baffling and powerful, it will soothe us for awhile thinking we have this thing licked, then it will break out of it's cage using every trick in it's not inconsiderable arsenal, one is one day we wake up and Sobriety Loses It's Priority, or a "Slip" in the parlance, if that doesn't work it turns the screws on us and makes us MISERABLE eventually, what kind of life is it where we obsess about alcohol all the time when we are not drinking, that isn't "recovery", that's a drink waiting to happen
Abstinence is the leading cause of relapse. Sounds kind of comical when heard for the first time. Almost like a contradiction of terms. In theory, abstinence is supposed to PREVENT relapse. How can it be RESPONSIBLE for relapse?
It turns out that the recovery process cannot be done in one simple phase. Not unlike getting a car or truck rolling along it takes more than one gear. Abstinence is comparable to first gear in a motor vehicle. It is the best and sometimes the only way to get a massive vehicle in motion but not unlike a car going down the highway, being stuck in first gear is destructive. At some point the cars engine will blow apart from too much stress.
Rehab programs seldom talk about this matter because it is simply not their job to talk about long-term recovery strategies. Their goal is typically one of getting the subject to reach some short-term goal that can be achieved and measured within a short time frame, Typically 30 or 90.
So what is the equivalent of second gear in the recovery process? Principles to live by. Specifically rules to live by that can be used to day in and day out without overloading ones psychic engine. Some of these principles can be summed up in simple to grasp slogans like; one-day-at-a-time, easy-does-it and first-things-first. These are more or less psychological tricks and tips that can be used in times of stress.
There is more to recovery however than just psychology. There is an even higher set of principles that can be viewed as the equivalent of over-drive in an automobile. That is spiritual instead of psychological principles.
Spiritual principles are harder to learn than psychological principles because some of them are hard to grasp at first. In fact, many of them are downright incomprehensible. That is why it is best to leave them for last in the learning process.
The fundamental spiritual principles are not too bad to deal with like honesty, open-mindedness and willingness but some of the deeper principles like humility and serenity are beyond the grasp of those new to the recovery process.
Perhaps thee most esoteric spiritual principle to grasp is true humility. A word often confused with humiliation. The easiest way to distinguish between the to is to remember that humiliation leads to fear, guilt and shame where humility leads to insight into new truth.
All those who are suffering from an addiction have a serious lack of insight. Humility, more than any other tool, can circumvent this problem and provide new and lasting paths to the truth about themselves, their disease and their potential to change.
Think of spiritual principles (AA) as the over-drive that allows to the auto to cruise for countless hours of stress-free progress on the life-long journey to recovery.
A guy wrote the following passage around 75 or 80 years ago, see if you can relate to anything he says here:
For most normal folks, drinking means conviviality, companionship and colorful imagination. It means release from care, boredom and worry. It is joyous intimacy with friends and a feeling that life is good. But not so with us in those last days of heavy drinking. The old pleasures were gone. They were but memories. Never could we recapture the great moments of the past. There was an insistent yearning to enjoy life as we once did and a heartbreaking obsession that some new miracle of control would enable us to do it. There was always one more attempt and one more failure.
The less people tolerated us, the more we withdrew from society, from life itself. As we became subjects of King Alcohol, shivering denizens of his mad realm, the chilling vapor that is loneliness settled down. It thickened, ever becoming blacker. Some of us sought out sordid places, hoping to find understanding companionship and approval. Momentarily we did then would come oblivion and the awful awakening to face the hideous Four Horsemen Terror, Bewilderment, Frustration, Despair. Unhappy drinkers who read this page will understand!
Now and then a serious drinker, being dry at the moment says, "I don't miss it at all. Feel better. Work better. Having a better time." As ex-problem drinkers, we smile at such a sally. We know our friend is like a boy whistling in the dark to keep up his spirits. He fools himself. Inwardly he would give anything to take half a dozen drinks and get away with them. He will presently try the old game again, for he isn't happy about his sobriety. He cannot picture life without alcohol. Some day he will be unable to imagine life either with alcohol or without it. Then he will know loneliness such as few do. He will be at the jumping-off place. He will wish for the end.
We have shown how we got out from under. You say, "Yes, I'm willing. But am I to be consigned to a life where I shall be stupid, boring and glum, like some righteous people I see? I know I must get along without liquor, but how can I? Have you a sufficient substitute?"
Yes, there is a substitute and it is vastly more than that. It is a fellowship in Alcoholics Anonymous. There you will find release from care, boredom and worry. Your imagination will be fired. Life will mean something at last. The most satisfactory years of your existence lie ahead. Thus we find the fellowship, and so will you.
My Point? Abstinence never worked for me nor for countless millions of other alcoholics, what use is a miserable white knuckle sobriety?
I really, truly wish you the best of luck, because without a program you are going to need it, a LOT of luck, like lightning will strike here luck...it does happen, just remember:
Hope is not a plan
Congratulations on Day..6..... I thought isn't it, anyway, hang in there, your answers will come if you keep doing what you are doing a day at a time
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
Hello MST3, and welcome to the board. I beqan my sober journey when my son was 2 also. I didn't want him to qrow up with a drunk for a father. I knew what that was like. He's 24 now and i'm a month away from 22 years without drinkinq. It was the best qift that I could've qiven him, but what I received couldn't be expressed in a mater of hours or days. I too tried to white knuckle my sobriety and it didn't really work for me. It wasn't until I was willinq to do whatever it took to qet sober, that I was ready to do what millions of others had done, in the proqram of AA, to qet sober. I started by takinq the suqqestion to attend meetinqs daily for the first 90 days, qettinq a sponsor.
-- Edited by StPeteDean on Friday 10th of June 2011 05:52:37 AM
then you have some much needed very important information, I suggest you go back and read through this thread very very carefully, the information is here
you are probably an alcoholic, which means you are powerless over alcohol, that doesn't mean we drink like fish 24/7, that means one day without help, no matter what we do, one day we say that..."I'm drunk", we keep thinking if we try a little harder for a little longer we can lick this thing and the results are heartbreakingly tragic, ...every time
Alcoholism is a two fold disease that is an obsession of the mind and an allergy of the body that ensures we can't stop drinking, since we take that first drink while we are sober, alcoholism centers in the mind, we have a mind that convinces us that it's OK to take a drink at some point, then our bodies process alcohol differently then normies, 1-2 drinks our judgment gets affected and then we get what is known as the phenomenon of craving, it's a double whammy that we can't think our way out of no matter how hard we try, any more then we can stop having diabetes by concentrating on not having diabetes, it's not our will power that is defective, it;s our minds and bodies, using will power on alcoholism is about as effective as using will power on the trots (diarrhea)
There is a solution and it's actually a pretty fun one, strangely enough
You may already have asked yourself why it is that all of us became so very ill from drinking. Doubtless you are curious to discover how and why, in the face of expert opinion to the contrary, we have recovered from a hopeless condition of mind and body. If you are an alcoholic who wants to get over it, you may already be asking What do I have to do?"
It is the purpose of this book to answer such questions specifically. We shall tell you what we have done. Before going into a detailed discussion, it may be well to summarize some points as we see them.
How many time people have said to us: "I can take it or leave it alone. Why can't he?" "Why don't you drink like a gentleman or quit?" "That fellow can't handle his liquor." "Why don't you try beer and wine?" "Lay off the hard stuff." "His will power must be weak." "He could stop if he wanted to." "She's such a sweet girl, I should think he'd stop for her sake." "The doctor told him that if he ever drank again it would kill him, but there he is all lit up again."
Now these are commonplace observations on drinkers which we hear all the time. Back of them is a world of ignorance and misunderstanding. We see that these expressions refer to people whose reactions are very different from ours.
Moderate drinkers have little trouble in giving up liquor entirely if they have good reason for it. They can take it or leave it alone.
Then we have a certain type of hard drinker. He may have the habit badly enough to gradually impair him physically and mentally. It may cause him to die a few years before his time. If a sufficiently strong reason ill health, falling in love, change of environment, or the warning of a doctor becomes operative, this man can also stop or moderate, although he may find it difficult and troublesome and may even need medical attention.
But what about the real alcoholic? He may start off as a moderate drinker; he may or may not become a continuous hard drinker; but at some stage of his drinking career he begins to lose all control of his liquor consumption, once he starts to drink.
Here is a fellow who has been puzzling you, especially in his lack of control. He does absurd, incredible, tragic things while drinking. He is a real Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. He is seldom mildly intoxicated. He is always more or less insanely drunk. His disposition while drinking resembles his normal nature but little. He may be one of the finest fellows in the world. Yet let him drink for a day, and he frequently becomes disgustingly, and even dangerously anti-social. He has a positive genius for getting tight at exactly the wrong moment, particularly when some important decision must be made or engagement kept. He is often perfectly sensible and well balanced concerning everything except liquor, but in that respect he is incredibly dishonest and selfish. He often possesses special abilities, skills, and aptitudes, and has a promising career ahead of him. He uses his gifts to build up a bright outlook for his family and himself, and then pulls the structure down on his head by a senseless series of sprees. He is the fellow who goes to bed so intoxicated he ought to sleep the clock around. Yet early next morning he searches madly for the bottle he misplace the night before. If he can afford it, he may have liquor concealed all over his house to be certain no one gets his entire supply away from him to throw down the wastepipe. As matters grow worse, he begins to use a combination of high-powered sedative and liquor to quiet his nerves so he can go to work. Then comes the day when he simply cannot make it and gets drunk all over again. Perhaps he goes to a doctor who gives him morphine or some sedative with which to taper off. Then he begins to appear at hospitals and sanitariums.
This is by no means a comprehensive picture of the true alcoholic, as our behavior patterns vary. But this description should identify him roughly.
Why does he behave like this? If hundreds of experiences have shown him that one drink means another debacle with all its attendant suffering and humiliation, why is it he takes that one drink? Why can't he stay on the water wagon? What has become of the common sense and will power that he still sometimes displays with respect to other matters?
Perhaps there never will be a full answer to these questions. Opinions vary considerably as to why the alcoholic reacts differently from normal people. We are not sure why, once a certain point is reached, little can be done for him. We cannot answer the riddle.
We know that while the alcoholic keeps away from drink, as he may do for months or years, he reacts much like other men. We are equally positive that once he takes any alcohol whatever into his system, something happens, both in the bodily and mental sense, which makes it virtually impossible for him to stop. The experience of any alcoholic will abundantly confirm this.
These observations would be academic and pointless if our friend never took the first drink, thereby setting the terrible cycle in motion. Therefore, the main problem of the alcoholic centers in his mind, rather than in his body. If you ask him why he started on that last bender, the chances are he will offer you any one of a hundred alibis. Sometimes these excuses have a certain plausibility, but none of them really makes sense in the light of the havoc an alcoholic's drinking bout creates. They sound like the philosophy of the man who, having a headache, beats himself on the head with a hammer so that he can't feel the ache. If you draw this fallacious reasoning to the attention of an alcoholic, he will laugh it off, or become irritated and refuse to talk.
Once in a while he may tell the truth. And the truth, strange to say, is usually that he has no more idea why he took that first drink than you have. Some drinkers have excuses with which they are satisfied part of the time. But in their hearts they really do not know why they do it. Once this malady has a real hold, they are a baffled lot. There is the obsession that somehow, someday, they will beat the game. But they often suspect they are down for the count.
How true this is, few realize. In a vague way their families and friends sense that these drinkers are abnormal, but everybody hopefully awaits the day when the sufferer will rouse himself from his lethargy and assert his power of will.
The tragic truth is that if the man be a real alcoholic, the happy day may not arrive. He has lost control. At a certain point in the drinking of every alcoholic, he passes into a state where the most powerful desire to stop drinking is of absolutely no avail. This tragic situation has already arrived in practically every case long before it is suspected.
The fact is that most alcoholics, for reasons yet obscure, have lost the power of choice in drink. Our so called will power becomes practically nonexistent. We are unable, at certain times, to bring into our consciousness with sufficient force the memory of the suffering and humiliation of even a week or a month ago. We are without defense against the first drink.
The almost certain consequences that follow taking even a glass of beer do not crowd into the mind to deter us. If these thoughts occur, they are hazy and readily supplanted with the old threadbare idea that this time we shall handle ourselves like other people. There is a complete failure of the kind of defense that keeps one from putting his hand on a hot stove.
The alcoholic may say to himself in the most casual way, "It won't burn me this time, so here's how!" Or perhaps he doesn't think at all. How often have some of us begun to drink in this nonchalant way, and after the third or fourth, pounded on the bar and said to ourselves, "For God's sake, how did I ever get started again?" Only to have that thought supplanted by "Well, I'll stop with the sixth drink." Or "What's the use anyhow?"
When this sort of thinking is fully established in an individual with alcoholic tendencies, he has probably placed himself beyond human aid, and unless locked up, may die or to permanently insane. These stark and ugly facts have been confirmed by legions of alcohoholics throughout history. But for the grace of God, there would have been thousands more convincing demonstrations. So many want to stop but cannot.
There is a solution. Almost none of us liked the self- searching, the leveling of our pride, the confession of shortcomings which the process requires for its successful consummation. But we saw that it really worked in others, and we had come to believe in the hopelessness and futility of life as we had been living it. When, therefore, we were approached by those in whom the problem had been solved, there was nothing left for us but to pick up the simple kit of spiritual tools laid at out feet. We have found much of heaven and we have been rocketed into a fourth dimension of existence of which we had not even dreamed.
The great fact is just this, and nothing less: That we have had deep and effective spiritual experiences* which have revolutionized our whole attitude toward life, toward our fellows and toward God's universe. The central fact of our lives today is the absolute certainty that our Creator has entered into our hearts and lives in a way which is indeed miraculous. He has commenced to accomplish those things for us which we could never do by ourselves.
If you are as seriously alcoholic as we were, we believe there is no middle-of-the-road solution. We were in a position where life was becoming impossible, and if we had passed into the region from which there is no return through human aid, we had but two alternatives: One was to go on to the bitter end, blotting out the consciousness of our intolerable situation as best we could; and the other, to accept spiritual help.
Spiritual Help doesn't always mean "Church help" although for many of us it does, we work the 12 steps which bring about what we call for a better explanation a "Spiritual Awakening" or upon careful reading is "a personality change that brings about recovery from alcoholism", a spiritual awakening is a euphemism for "an ability to fit ourselves into the world around us without having to take a drink"
There is no shame in you having gotten drunk, provided you take the information you have learned and put it to good use, mainly...you probably can't do this alone...the only shame would be if you ignored this information and continued to try to quit on your own and that boy of yours grew up in a distorted household with a drunken father, in that case shame would be the appropriate emotion for causing what we call "the warped lives of blameless children"
You have the information, action is the antidote, welcome back, we recomend going to 90 meetings in 90 days, getting a sponsor and working the steps, and we have rarely seen anyone fail that thoroughly followed our path and do what we did
-- Edited by LinBaba on Saturday 9th of July 2011 07:51:21 AM
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
