She texted me this morning to let me know that it didn't matter how many letters I sent... should would not change her mind. ( I refused to sign the divorce papers and sent a letter instead) I did not respond and will not respond to the curcumstances. I will contine to focus on pleasing God and loving my wife as Christ loves the church. I felt comfort and joy wash over me after recieving this text. It seems every negative response fills me with joy and peace and a greater desire to continue The Love Dare. I prayed for God to continue to detach me from the circumstances and follow His Will. I do have to guard my thoughts and not dwell on the negative, but that gets easier each day.
But along with this is a lessening desire to drink. When I didn't get my way in the past, the first thing I did was to grab a beer which would usually be the first of many. My first thought was to grab a beer. It was an automatic response. But the last couple of days, my first response is to smile, hit my knees and praise God.
Each morning I rejoice in the day that God created for me and resolve to be happy and not let the circumstances disrupt my inner peace and serenity. That doesn't mean I'm blowing sunshine up everyone's butt every minute of the day, but it means God has given me the spiritual tools to prosper through any situation. In doing so, my attitude is better and my relationships are better, except with the wife, but.... :)
Dear friend, I am by NO means a relationship expert, but I feel I must say something here.
I admire your positive outlook... however not dwelling on the negative does not mean not facing reality. Your resistance to cooperating with your wife is concerning to me. You do not want to become a stalker of this poor woman! If she does not want to be married to you, why do you want to force her to? I'm reminded of the saying, "If you love something set it free, if it loves you it will come back to you." Love cannot grow when controlled. It's not something you can or should keep under lock and key.
Speaking as someone with a bit of divorce experience, when a woman has made up her mind to send papers, she is DONE. She wants to move on or possibly already has. I know this is hard to hear and I am sorry.
I pray for acceptance and peace for you. You have a good foundation with God, fellowship in the program, and if you keep working it, you will make it through this a stronger and better person, but first you must surrender. You are powerless over drinking and you are powerless over people and relationships.
Sorry Heather but I dont agree all the way. I filed divorce papers to see if my ex would rise to the occasion and fight for the marriage. He did not. He laid down and died. Im not saying this is the case. But to give it your all is not a bad thing. If mj is in tune with his higher power he will know when it is truly over. Just my opinion. I filed to show how serious I was and his not doing anything showed me his side. I guess for me Its good to see that some people give it all they have up to the end. And I am not a relationship expert either!! lol by no means. Just my honest opinion. Mad Jasper just keep, keeping on. Trust your higher power and keep working on the steps!
I am compelled to respect your definition of marriage. I would want the same type of respect if society continues to move along the the same lines which would allow me to get married.
Booyah! Super political controversial hijack of this thread!
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
I understand what your point of view, and I absolutely do not want to become a stalker, but this is not just a simple black and white issue.
There is a difference in considered the negative and dwelling on the negative. I will never forget the things I have done to hurt others and myself, but I refuse to dwell on those things. I must stay positive and accept that all things I have done will be used for good. Romans 8:28
This is not about controlling or forcing her to do anything. This not about ME wanting to be married to her. Yes, I am familiar with the phrase, "If you love someone, set them free" and I have wholeheatedly lived by that motto. But my wife does not need my signature to get divorced. I am not contesting the terms of the divorce. She can still file, there would most likely be a hearing in which I will forfeit my rights and she will be granted a divorce. I doubt it will be much of a delay for her then she can move on with her life. If any of these things did not apply or if she had to spend thousands on an attorney, I may resond differently, but absolutely nothing changes her desired outcome whether I sign or not. I have no desire to trap her in this marriage. In fact, before I surrendered to God and accepted my alcoholism, I was ready to move on... have some meaningless sex and party like the old days. For a couple of months, I had been regretting getting married so soon.
Man, it would soooo much easier to just sign the papers, believe me!!!
I am not trying to change her mind... I am trying to change my heart. As I said earlier, part of recovery is surrendering to God. Surrendering to God means to be obedient to God in all things, not just what I pick and choose. The Love Dare is dealing with issues specific to me, not her. It is trying to change me, not her. And in dealing with her harsh texts, I am changing. I am learing to act, not react. To seek God's wisdom, to love unconditionally. This is having positive affects on all my relationships... except for the one with my wife, but that's ok because in the end, this is about me and God... and without God, I would not be sober.
I appreciate you response and advice, but it is based on the assumption that I am unable to move on. That's just not the case.
One more thing Heather, I did call an attorney to ensure this would not cause her any unnecesarry problems. The attorny assured me that aside from a minor delay, she would be granted a divorce.
Again, I do appreciate your advice though. I like your honesty.
-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Friday 18th of March 2011 12:57:39 PM
-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Friday 18th of March 2011 01:05:25 PM
Well, got another text. This one mocked me sending flowers, told me any contact with her unless it involved signed divorce papers would be considered harrassment, that she refused the flowers, and to enjoy my cell bill! Ouch! Stung a bit. However, it reaffirms that this about me and God, not me and her.
She is angry and I prayed for her happiness and peace. As far as contact, I will seek creative ways to complete The Love Dare with minimal contact until she has me arrested!
Aloha Jasper...In a quiet meditative moment you might also find the perspective that this might be an opportunity from the God that you love to correct a mistake you made years ago.
When I was doing my forth step with my sponsor and looking at the mistakes I had made and the wreckage that it had cause others and myself one of them was the affair I was having with my alcoholic/addict wife and the marriage I entered into while getting a clear vertical message that I shouldn't do it. God doesn't abandon and so stayed with me up to and including the inventory, thru the making it right (divorce) and right up to this moment. God gives us support and moments to make things right; it's Biblical and recovery practice. To adamantly refuse is from ego and pride ...arrogance. Your justification seems spiritually loyal on the surface but the 4th step calls for a "Searching...Fearless and Moral (the difference between good and bad; right and wrong...no judgment from me) inventory".
Let go of the control and manipulation, contact God and your Sponsor and take the next step.
Jerry, I can honestly tell you that that I signed and was mailing the papers when something said "wait". I spoke to my couselor and he said "wait". I don't have a sponsor yet, I intend on working on that this weekend. I prayed all weekend long, sought answers in scriptures and meditation. I called an attorney and made certain that the absence of my signature would have no bearing on the outcome. I prayed about again and then some more. I was honest with myself and God regarding my motives. The answer was clear... do not sign the papers.
The arrogant and self-serving thing to do would be to sign the papers... move on. Not that it really makes any difference, because she will be granted a divorce if she files. I know many people that have divorced and reconciled... divorce is not necessarily the end of a relationship. But to please God, I have to give everything I have into this marriage... whether she accepts or rejects it. Again Jerry, this is not keeping her tied to me. She is free to do as she wishes. I will not check on her, ride by her apartment, ask what she is doing, contact her family as an attempt to keep tabs on her, or restrict her in any other way. I still pay for her cell phone and benefits. I will stand for my marriage and for God, but I won't beat her over the head with my spirituallity. I have absolved her of any wrongdoing in our marriage and agreed that she had every right to file for divorce. I have accepted full responsibility for our separation. I just will not sign the papers.
My desire to please God and fix my marriage did not come out of her leaving. I kicked her out because of my pride... because I reacted to something she said that wasn't even mean-spirited. My desire to please God and fix my marriage began to grow as I surrendered myself to God because I feared that I had developed a "drinking problem". And now God has given me the spiritual tools necessary to respond in kindness, or in some case not respond at all, to her very angry, mean-spirited text. That's spiritual growth.
And the best part of this is that tomorrow, I will be one month sober. And the last few days, I haven't even considered having a drink.
Well, got another text. This one mocked me sending flowers, told me any contact with her unless it involved signed divorce papers would be considered harrassment, that she refused the flowers, and to enjoy my cell bill! Ouch! Stung a bit. However, it reaffirms that this about me and God, not me and her.
She is angry and I prayed for her happiness and peace. As far as contact, I will seek creative ways to complete The Love Dare with minimal contact until she has me arrested!
Do you think this will get her back? Do you feel disregarding her wishes is "love"? How does disregarding her wishes to be shed of you translate into God's will? Do you think God wants you to make this woman's life hell on earth by not leaving her alone? By not granting her the divorce she so desperately wants and making her dislike you even more? How is this love?
I have found it's best for me to check with others when I think I know God's will for me, this kind of reminds me of Moby Dick and Capt Ahab, where it's actually hurt pride and self justification running the show rather then God's will but I suspect you and I have different Gods, which is OK, but my God wants me to be happy joyous and free and to do the next right thing, not emotionally blackmail and hold other people hostage, your God confuses me
the best part of this is that tomorrow, I will be one month sober. And the last few days, I haven't even considered having a drink.
"The alcoholic is like a tornado roaring his way through the lives of others. Hearts are broken. Sweet relationships are dead. Affections have been uprooted. Selfish and inconsiderate habits have kept the home in turmoil. We feel a man is unthinking when he says that sobriety is enough. He is like the farmer who came up out of his cyclone cellar to find his home ruined. To his wife, he remarked, "Don't see anything the matter here, Ma. Ain't it grand the wind stopped blowin'?" -- "Alcoholics Anonymous" (AA's Big Book) Chapter 6, 'Into Action,' pg. 82
-- Edited by LinBaba on Friday 18th of March 2011 03:17:02 PM
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
"Do you think this will get her back? Do you feel disregarding her wishes is "love"? How does disregarding her wishes to be shed of you translate into God's will"
I don't think any action that I take can influence her decision... except for pushing her away more. I find that quoting scriptures in not wise, but I think it is clear that God hates divorce and only releases a person from that commitment in certain circumstances. In my state, is is quite easy to get a divorce. Two people agree, sign and it is done in 31 days. In this case, she can still file, a judge will grant a hearing that I will not attend, and he/she will still grant the divorce. Accourding to the attorney I spoke with, not signing may delay it a couple of weeks longer, but that is it.
"? Do you think God wants you to make this woman's life hell on earth by not leaving her alone?"
As for contacting her, have made very few attempts to contact her. In fact, I've almost exclusively replied to her unless it was of the utmost importance. In some cases, I may not evey reply. As I said in my last post, I will have to find ways to finish the dares with no or minimal contact. It can be done, but it is more challenging. I have not looked too far ahead at the dares, but some of the ways I can complete the dares is by maintaining her health benefits, paying for small bills if they come to my address instead of passing them on to her, not speaking ill of her, taking care of the insurance claims that were filed incorrectly, praying for her... things like that. Nowhere have I said that I was going to contact her daily to tell her that I love her and I want her back or that I was determined to trap her in this marriage.
"By not granting her the divorce she so desperately wants and making her dislike you even more? How is this love?"
The divorce is as easily attainable whether I grant it or not.
""I have found it's best for me to check with others when I think I know God's will for me, this kind of reminds me of Moby Dick and Capt Ahab, where it's actually hurt pride and self justification running the show rather then God's will"
I have spoken with others and prayed with others. I attend Christian couseling once a week. I am in close contact with my pastor's wife. I speak to my ex-wife daily.
"but I suspect you and I have different Gods, which is OK, but my God wants me to be happy joyous and free and to do the next right thing, not emotionally blackmail and hold other people hostage, your God confuses me"
In regards to the Moby Dick and Capt Ahab comment, I can see where you may percieve this that way. But it really is just the opposite for me. I've always have problems with pride in the past. I didn't take crap off no one. Most of my relationships aside from my first wife lasted for weeks because of that attitude. I felt like everyone had to think like me and if they didn't, to hell with them. And if someone insulted me, they were dead to me. The dares are humilating. You can't be full of pride and complete the dares. You also can go into with motives of getting your spouse back. That's not why I chose to do the dares and I have been clear about that.
And again, I would be emotionally blackmailing her and holding her hostage if I was telling how wrong she was to leave me, telling her that she will regret it, that I couldn't live without her, if by not signing I was preventing her from getting a divorce or even significantly delaying it or doing other things to manipulate or force her into staying married. I'm doing none of those things.
Well I disagree with what you are doing on the most profound and fundamental level but I don't disapprove of you and don't disaprove of your right to do it if that makes sense, along the lines of what Rev Martin Luther King Jr said "disagree without being disagreeable" and I understand drawing the line in the sand saying "I will not assist her in divorcing me in any way, if she wants to divorce me she has to do everything herself"
I also have to say I agree with what Jerry wrote 110% but he and I have the benefit of hindsight, working the steps uncovers motives and the subsequent actions we never knew we had, so I am expecting you to view your behavior in the lense of already working a searching and fearless moral inventory, which you haven't done yet
be interesting to glean your relevations as you go through that process over the next few months, I look forward to watching that process and hear the slaps to the forehead over the internet that accompany steps 4 and 5
Keep coming back kid, it gets better
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
I did offer to pay half of the divorce fees regardless of signing, but she refused.
Look, I re-evaluate this on an hour-by-hour basis. I think others reading through this pick up on a certain arrogance in my posts that may or may not actually be there. I've spent hours each day praying for His will and for Him to put people in my path that will help me discern and accomplish His will. That doesn't mean that everything I do is right in God's eyes, but I am truly seeking His ways and trying to set aside mine. My intent is to stand on my marriage to fulfill my commitment I made to God whether or not my wife releases me of my commitment. I still made a commitment to God and though I have, in some ways, violated that commitment, I don't have to keep doing so. It is my intent to show her kindness and love (not in the romantic sense) no matter how she responds to me. But I do have to be careful not to invoke a response so I can say, "look how kind I am even though she's being nasty"... I get that. It is not my intent to force her to be married to me or to cause her undue hardship and embarrassment. It's not my intent to harass her. So do pray about this constantly. I pray about my recovery. I pray for wisdom. I won't do everything right, but I'll do my best.
To what Jerry said, there are a lot of things that I didn't like about my wife. We clearly rushed into marriage. She didn't always make good decisions and sometimes that lead to more drama in or lives that was necessary. She could be incredibly thoughtful, but sometimes, incredibly hard to deal with. It's not that I am just heartbroken and pining away for her every minute. Things have been peaceful since she left and my daughter seems very happy. But I believe that if I just give up without making a real effort to save this marriage (even when at first, I wasn't so sure I wanted to), then I am not pleasing God.
So, I'll worry about, tomorrow. And I will celebrate my 1-month of sobriety with a great workout and a protein shake!
One more thing. I also realize that signing the papers doesn't necessarily mean I'm giving up if I have made an real effort in signing papers. It's just not going to be my first resort.
-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Friday 18th of March 2011 04:45:56 PM
Like LB, I have had to bounce things off the fellowship for me to know if this looks like God's will, because my thinking becomes soooooo distorted.
This would NOT look like a solution from my HP because ... what would be the MOTIVE for not signing? Isn't it selfish and self-seeking? Isn't it all about Self?
It would be a very different thing if this didn't directly affect somebody.
It would make more sense to me, to view it as direction to move forward by becoming the man you believe your HP wants you to be, she will have been a beautiful instrument your HP has used to achieve that.
You sent flowers? Really? Knowing how she feels? Personally, MJ, that doesn't seem loving to me at all, it would only fuel my anger that you have no respect for me. Like, I don't matter, I am not being heard, I am invisible.
My sponsor once passed along something from the bible that says, "if someone rejects you, shake the dust off your feet and move on."
I believe I should be the person my HP wants me to be, by all means. It should never hurt anyone else.
Wait a minute here ... I am powerless over alcohol.
To my knowledge it doesnt say anywhere in our literature ( BB ) that we are powerless over ppl,places and things . Actually it says we have been given the power to help others. Hmmm....
Ya know , it has been my experience that when something was happening that I didnt like, and couldnt change, I stayed silent, and prayed for the person or thing that was upsetting me.
And just my opinion .. flowers are uhh.. a little over kill. Leave her alone, forget about her for awhile. Keep the focus on you and staying sober. Get a sponsor, and soon!!!
Again, not signing really doesn't affect her. She can still file and will still be granted a divorce... no additional costs, maybe another two weeks. The point in me not signing, at this point, is that I am not just simply giving up when things got difficult.
Understand, that at no point in our relationship, did the subject of breaking up or divorcing. I was never criticized for my drinking. The drinking was apparently my problem, although I can see in hindsight how poisonous drinking was to my mind. Two days before she left, I asked her specifically I had done something to upset her before we left for work. She said no and that I was wonderful to her and the kids. She had just been feeling down about losing her job and the drama with her ex..... and that we'd talk more later. This wasn't like I had been told to straighten up, or she was leaving. It was just sudden. That doesn't mean we were both necessarily happy, it just came out of nowhere. Just 3 weeks early, she put together an awesome 40th B-day for me and bought me an amazingly, thoughtful gift. This is just weird.
Back to the contact and flowers, I'm not claiming that I do everything right. I am seeking God through His word, prayer, the counselor and other people that he puts in my life. Let me be clear, HE gave me the desire to stop drinking and the power to do so. AA is a tool to help me maintain sobriety and better myself. If my sponsor tells me to do something that conflicts with what I feel is God's will for me, I will choose God's will. There are people in the fellowship that I speak with and I rely on them for many things, but I don't feel it necessary to seek their approval of what God's will for me is, especially when I don't know many of them very well. In time, that may change, but for now, I will rely on prayer, God's Word and the people in my life that I know that serve God like my counselor, the pastor's wife, my ex-wife, etc.
From this point forward, I feel it may be best to stick with solely with the subject of my alcoholism rather than discussing my marriage. I certainly don't mind the criticism and if someone wants to PM me, I will be happy to discuss it, but I don't want to be a stumbling block to someone else, especially if they are still trying to find their HP. If something major happens concerning my marriage, I will share it though.
-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Friday 18th of March 2011 08:25:53 PM
I doubt God wrote the Love Dare...not that there is anything wrong with a Christian marriage manual, but I'd be careful not to ascribe to God that which is only human interpretation. Holding someone else like an emotional hostage in the name of the Lord doesn't seem like love to me. I do think it's reasonably decent to have checked that the refusal won't cause an actual (however legal) hostage situation. I'm with Heather on this one. Of course what is most important is staying sober through all this.
You are only seeking counsel from other fundamentalist people who are likely going to agree with anything you say. I hope you don't have problems in AA due to not being open-minded enough. More people have problems accepting that there is a God, but some people do have problems thinking they understand God perfectly already. If you had a direct pipeline to God and knew his will already, you wouldn't be in this situation.
Christian counseling is also a big racket in my opinion and it usually consists of people who are not well trained and not liscenced providing therapy they shouldn't be doing. But again...this is an AA forum and it takes all different types to keep AA running. You just stay true to yourself MJ and stay sober.
Good job on the 30 days! That is momentous and all would agree that some higher power helped with that.
You have quoted the bible a few times...Just wondering, have you read the big book yet? Have you read the 12 and 12?
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
pinkchip wrote: some people do have problems thinking they understand God perfectly already. If you had a direct pipeline to God and knew his will already, you wouldn't be in this situation. Kinda like this Mark?
Hence it was most evident that a solitary self appraisal, and the admission of our defects based on that alone, wouldn't be nearly enough. We'd have to have outside help if we were surely to know and admit the truth about ourselves--the help of God and another human being. Only by discussing ourselves, holding back nothing, only by being willing to take advice and and accept direction could we set foot on the road to straight thinking, solid honesty, and genuine humility.
Yet many of us still clung back. We said, "Why can't 'God as we understand him' tell us where we are astray? If the Creator gave us our lives in the first place, then he must know in every detail where we have since gone wrong. Why don't we make our admissions to him directly? Why do we need to bring anyone else into this?"
The second difficulty is this: what comes to us alone may be garbled by our own rationalization and wishful thinking. The benefit of talking to another person is that we can get his direct comment and counsel on our situation, and there can be no doubt in our minds what that advice is. Going it alone in spiritual matters is dangerous. How many times have we heard well-intentioned people claimthe guidance of God when it was all too plain that they were sorely mistaken. Lacking both practice and humility, they had deluded themselves and were able to justify the most arrant nonsense on the ground that this was what God told them. It is worth noting that people of very high spiritual development almost always insist on checking with friends or spiritual advisors the guidance they feel they have received from God. Surely, then, an novice ought not lay himself open to the chance of making foolish, perhaps tragic blunders in this fashion. While the comment or advice of others may be by no means infallible, it is likely to be far more specific than any direct guidance we may receive while we are still so inexperienced in establishing contact with a Power greater than ourselves. I have found it impossible to communicate with those who feel they have a direct pipeline to God and who think they have an infallible and unshakable belief in thinking they know what God's will is for them and others, this is the kind of thinking where it makes perfect sense to light someone on fire in the name of love because they don't believe as you do, who would Jesus bomb" I ask myself and sigh.... I think Jasper is going to go it alone on this one despite the overwhelming response to check his ego and pride at the door and check in with other folks, I feel like this actually when trying to get through
-- Edited by LinBaba on Friday 18th of March 2011 09:14:49 PM
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
Hey MJ, I liked the plan to simply say to her "I can't divorce you because I still want you and think we should work it out, but I will not stop you from doing what you think is right". I thought your plan was "If you love something let it free". I thought the idea was that you knew you could not stop her, but to show her the path back was still open on your end if your new, sober life was to her liking and you could reestablish the trust and respect. This takes time, and if she is going to press on, this comes under things you can not change. I think you should assure her of your position through your lawyer and make her comfortable with the fact that you are going to play by her rules. She needs to trust and verify that you will not go "stalker" on her. That takes time, and thats time you can use to get your program straight. Get a year under your belt and if she has moved on.......then it might be time to look for your soul mate. Right now, her lawyer is telling her "NO CONTACT EXCEPT THROUGH HIM(OR HER)" Thats "lawyering up". Respect that. Work on you. You are doing great. You are working hard. That is being rewarded by your feeling of peace. I guess I do not understand the "Love Dare" but overall I think your plan is a sound one and when she figures out and trusts that your plan is to let her find her way, you will both be able to move forward no matter what the outcome. Also, you are getting advice here from some real pros (excluding me) Pinkchip is a professional counselor, and Lin Baba, Jerry F and the others are very much "technicians" when it comes to the nuts and bolts of the AA program. I am not sure how much "AA" I am hearing from you, as far as using this forum to help with the drinking. I know you are working with another inspiring group, and it sounds great, but are you actually working the steps? What we know is what worked for us. Fix the drinking first using the established practices of AA, and the rest follows. It will dovetail with your Christian faith, and is not a substitute for your Christian faith. It runs in tandem.
-- Edited by turninggrey on Friday 18th of March 2011 09:36:47 PM
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"You're in the right place. That's the door right there. Turn around."
I'd really try not to overthink this whole thing right now. I wouldn't do anything if I didn't have to purely for self presevation. You're probably still a wee bit insane right now and really need to focus on the recovery.
My rehab psycologist told me NOT to make any major discisions in the first 3 months, and I've noticed that everytime I tried to fix things with my wife it got worse but when I left it alone it got better.
Oh...I was also sharing my opinion like an arsehole by the way MJ. I figured as long as you were sharing yours.... Christian counseling is WAY better than no counseling. In essense, seeking help in any form is a good thing. I think when you read the literature, you will find overlap between it and the bible...it's kinda cool that way. Like the 10 commandments, the steps are a simple way to live...abliet designed for alcoholics and addicts.
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Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
You wasn't being an arse at all pinkchip and I really appreciate the input from all of you. I certainly don't think I have some special hookup to God's Will, but I do pray for it be revealed to me daily as well as any selfish motivations that my hinder the decisions that I ultimately make.
I will make many mistakes, I'm certain, I'll learn from those mistakes and hopefully help someone else avoid making the same mistakes I've made.
-- Edited by Mad_Jasper on Tuesday 22nd of March 2011 07:48:25 AM
Before I came to AA and worked the steps I always meant well, but somehow kept hurting those around me, and I didn't know how or why, and it was always their fault, even when I admitted to making a mistake, it was -their- inability to see -the truth- of the situation that caused all the rifts in my relationships
Before I got to AA I judged myself by my intentions when everyone around me judged me by my actions, I always meant well, but it always somehow went wrong
When I got to step 3 with a sponsor I learned what "the problem" was
Me
It wasn't drinking, it was....me...drinking was but a symptom
I was the problem, me and my stupid thinking
The first requirement is that we be convinced that any life run on self-will can hardly be a success. On that basis we are almost always in collision with something or somebody, even though our motives are good. Most people try to live by self-propul sion. Each person is like an actor who wants to run the whole show; is forever trying to arrange the lights, the ballet, the scenery and the rest of the players in his own way. If his arrangements would only stay put, if only people would do as he wish ed, the show would be great. Everybody, including himself, would be pleased. Life would be wonderful. In trying to make these arrangements our actor may sometimes be quite virtuous. He may be kind, considerate, patient, generous; even modest and self-s acrificing. On the other hand, he may be mean, egotistical, selfish and dishonest. But, as with most humans, he is more likely to have varied traits.
What usually happens? The show doesn't come off very well. He begins to think life doesn't treat him right. He decides to exert himself more. He becomes, on the next occasion, still more demanding or gracious, as the case may be. Still the play does not suit him. Admitting he may be somewhat at fault, he is sure that other people are more to blame. He becomes angry, indignant, self-pitying. What is his basic trouble? Is he not really a self-seeker even when trying to be kind? Is he not a victim of the delusion that he can wrest satisfaction and happiness out of this world if he only manages well? Is it not evident to all the rest of the players that these are the things he wants? And do not his actions make each of them wish to retaliate, snatchin g all they can get out of the show? Is he not, even in his best moments, a producer of confusion rather than harmony?
Our actor is self-centered, ego-centric, as people like to call it nowadays. Whatever our protest ations, are not most of us concerned with ourselves, our resentments, or our self-pity?
Selfishness, self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles. Driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity, we step on the toes of our fellows and they retaliate. Sometimes they hurt us, seemingly without provocation, but we invariably find that at some time in the past we have made decisions based on self which later placed us in a position to be hurt.
So our troubles, we think, are basically of our own making. They arise out of ourselves, and the alcoholic is an extreme example of self-will run riot, though he usually doesn't think so
So I sat down with him, and went through my life, writing down my resentments, my fears, my relationship history, and in my relationship history I made a startling discovery, it was the same relationship, over and over, before I put it in writing I had a "story" about why my relationships went the way they did, but seeing them in a column made me realize it was me, I was the common denominator, I was the train wreck doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results
Putting out of our minds the wrongs others had done, we resolutely looked for our own mistakes. Where had we been selfish, dishonest, self-seeking and frightened? Though a situation had not been entirely our fault, we tr ied to disregard the other person involved entirely. Where were we to blame? The inventory was ours, not the other man's. When we saw our faults we listed them. We placed them before us in black and white. We admitted our wrongs honestly and were willing to set these matters straight.
When I did that I saw I made the same mistakes over and over, I was all consumed with ME, I had been selfish, self seeking even when thinking I was kind, even when thinking I was a "good man" it was to manipulate others to my own wilful desires
I have never seen someone who didn't work the steps understand that concept, and I have never seen someone work the steps thoroughly without coming to that conclusion, hence the "blah blah blah Ginger blah blah"
When I sat down with my sponsor he helped me see my character defects, how by my actions I caused every single thing in my life to come to pass, I had somewhere, somehow made decisions based on self that placed me in a position to be hurt...
It was no wonder my girlfriend left me, I didn't "see" her, I didn't "hear" her, I didn't respect her wants, needs and wishes, even when I thought I was being selfless there were price tags, I was so monumentally self centered as to be delusionally insane
As is every alcoholic...period, that is a non negotiable feature of this disease, got a drinking problem? then selfishness and self centeredness is your primary problem, an inability to see those around us, and to understand the impact of our actions on them
She texted me this morning to let me know that it didn't matter how many letters I sent... should would not change her mind.
( I refused to sign the divorce papers and sent a letter instead)
I did not respond and will not respond to the curcumstances. I will continue to focus on pleasing God and loving my wife as Christ loves the church. I felt comfort and joy wash over me after recieving this text. It seems every negative response fills me with joy and peace and a greater desire to continue The Love Dare. I prayed for God to continue to detach me from the circumstances and follow His Will. I do have to guard my thoughts and not dwell on the negative, but that gets easier each day.
Why would each time she gets more and more frustrated and angry fill you with more love and peace? How is that healthy? How is that healthy for you OR your wife?
Could it be this sort of intranisigance, mule headedness, and inability to "see" her, "hear" her, and respect her wishes are why she's leaving you in the first place? and no it wasn't just that one fight, one fight doesn't end marriages
The following passage, justified by a "message from God" or just simply self justification is one of the single most frightening things on the planet today, a simple inability or desire to ponder one's impact on another because of self justification and rationalization and distorted pride and smugness, the world is a much poorer place for it
Selfishness, self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles. Driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity, we step on the toes of our fellows and they retaliate. Sometimes they hurt us, seemingly without provocation, but we invariably find that at some time in the past we have made decisions based on self which later placed us in a position to be hurt.
Keep doing what you are doing, and you keep getting what you are getting
-- Edited by LinBaba on Tuesday 22nd of March 2011 01:25:38 PM
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
