Starting my 7th sober day since I was sixteen!!

Angel T · Member

Starting my 7th sober day since I was sixteen!!

happycamper · MIP Old Timer

Good for You!!

It has been my experience that I couldnt quit drinking on my own and needed a Power greater than myself. I found that Power in Alcoholics Anonymous and I pray I stay forever grateful.

Sid · Senior Member

Congratulations Angel on making a great decision to stay sober. Glad that your site is helping you to stay sober. I have no doubt you can do this, if you really want it.

LinBaba · MIP Old Timer

Angel T wrote:

This is what I'm doing and it is helping me tremendously :

http://angelonthewagon.blogspot.com/

It may help you to start one of your own or feel free to stop by mine. I am starting to believe I can really do this!!! Love to you all!

Angel

Welcome and congratulations on 7 days

Here are some of the methods we have tried: Drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums we could increase the list ad infinitum.

Now we can add sober blogging

I liked this one Amy posted yesterday

5 things nobody tells you about quitting drinking

I particularly identified with the bit about the life sized crucifix, but our experiences vary.....

Here in order to achieve and maintain long term sobriety and emotional stability we attend meetings, get a sponsor, work the steps and help others, if you find you need a little help to maintain your sobriety or emotional well being as time passes (don't worry about getting in touch with your feelings, they will be getting in touch with you....soon) please feel free to attend a meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous, if you have a problem with alcohol you will be welcomed, made to feel at home, and shown how you never have to drink again, and can generally meet people with anywhere from 50 days to 50 years of sobriety who will be more then happy to show you how they did it, even here on this forum we have folks with anywhere from 1 year to 35 years or so who will be happy to share with you how they stayed sober.

Keep coming back, we do care and want to share your sober time with you, reach out for help or to help those with less time any time, we find doing this together is a lot easier then going it alone, and if and when you have any questions about staying sober or the program of alcoholics anonymous you will find a wealth of experience here at your disposal

-- Edited by LinBaba on Sunday 7th of November 2010 08:55:23 AM

StPeteDean · MIP Old Timer

Angel having a blog is good, although the some of the value of journaling may be lost by making it public (more or less) because of the temptation to write, what is perceived to be, what others want to hear for the sake of popularity. We had a guy about a year ago do the same and he made cut and paste posts here of his blog entries. He was not attending AA or working a program, just going off willpower alone. I think that he made it about 4 months, started drinking again and disappeared. People pleasing is a huge character defect of every alcoholic. Also, if that's all that you're planning on doing to get sober, odds are steep that you're not going to get it done, unless of course, you're not really an alcoholic. Only about 1 out of 20 alcoholics, that tries to get sober, makes it to a year of continuous sobriety. My favorite question is, "what are you going to do for your sobriety that's better then what the other 19 people did, who have to go back to drinking so that, statistically, You can stay sober?". Of course to answer that question, you'd need to know what others are doing to get sober. That's what we do in here is talk about how we're getting and staying sober. This IS The Blog. lol

-- Edited by StPeteDean on Sunday 7th of November 2010 10:19:03 AM

SteveP · MIP Old Timer

Congrats on 7 days!

Keep coming back.

Steve

leeu · MIP Old Timer

"This IS the Blog", sez Dean--Love it! :)

I copy and paste some of the most useful (to me) posts from this and other recovery sites into a Word doc that I keep on my flashdrive (no names, of course) so I have a daily read of this good stuff even if there is no Internet connection but I can plug into a computer somewhere.

LinBaba · MIP Old Timer

StPeteDean wrote:
This IS The Blog.

Zigackly

If nothing changes, nothing changes

and this is just me.....and...Einstein....and every single other alcoholic I have ever met in my life, but I can't fix what is broken with the same level of thinking that caused it to be broken in the first place

or in other words, none of us so far have been able to "think" ourselves sober

dale63 · Member

If you are not going to AA, then good luck. But remember we could not find an easier softer way. Also we should remain anonymous in press radio and films, this moves into social media as well.

StPeteDean · MIP Old Timer

Good point Dale. Someone wana post that tradition here?

dale63 · Member

That is one thing I dont understand about the forums when people post pictures and names. But I do not judge. I just trudge.

StPeteDean · MIP Old Timer

Dale, in OP's defense, AA in SoCal is not very anonymous. It's almost fashionable lol I've never been very anonymous myself, just don't have any reason to be. I understand totally why others do. It's definitely a personal choice. Good points though.

Aquaman · MIP Old Timer

Hey Angel!
Good for you and thanks for sharing with us.

I can totally understand the desire to blog the experience. I considered blogging my benzo withdrawals but couldn't sit still long enough.

There is an old AA saying - "You alone can do it, but you can't do it alone."

Your blog is a way to share OUT, but without a support network of other alkies or addicts, there is nothing for you to take and an alkie who isn't taking something from somebody is too far out of their element.

Really, no kidding...get to a meeting and let Us help You so you can have a We.

Peace,
Rob

LinBaba · MIP Old Timer

dale63 wrote:

If you are not going to AA, then good luck. But remember we could not find an easier softer way. Also we should remain anonymous in press radio and films, this moves into social media as well.

If the Blogger is not a member of AA the point is moot, also if the blogger uses an alias (as we all do here) the point is moot

11.) Our relations with the general public should be characterized by personal anonymity. We think A.A. ought to avoid sensational advertising. Our names and pictures as A.A. members ought not be broadcast, filmed, or publicly printed. Our public relations should be guided by the principle of attraction rather than promotion. There is never need to praise ourselves. We feel it better to let our friends recommend us

I see the paparazzi identify many of us (that are famous) as "members of AA" or "attending AA" or even as Sober, but generally speaking I don't see very many actual successful adherants to the Program break their own Anonymity, one exception being Roger Ebert who wrote about being a member of AA with over 20 years of sobriety, and while I admit to it breaking a tradition and me having a bit of a hard time about that, I also thought it was a great article and did us far more good then harm, the only people who were bothered by it were people in AA who were bummed he broke his anonymity

Over the years I have seen dozens and dozens of famous people with long term sobriety in meetings and never had a clue they were sober, famous Actors, Singers, pro athletes, writers, producers, comedians, etc al

I don't feel the Lindsay Lohans or The Darryl Strawberries really count, as they are court ordered members of AA usually, and I DEFINATELY thought Gavin Newsome's Publicists wife was WAY out of line for doing her "9th step amends" in front of the media, ESPECIALLY since what she was sharing about was banging the Mayor (sleeping with her husbands best friend) on National TV and Print, that broke so many steps and Traditions I think it might have been a record

I admit to being bummed that I missed seeing her speak recently though, I was visiting my old stomping grounds and went to an old meeting I used to be a regular at for a few decades and she was the speaker the week before, I would have liked to hear her justification for that Goatf**k of a 9th step

-- Edited by LinBaba on Sunday 7th of November 2010 07:05:59 PM

Angel T · Member

Thank you so much for the support. I am understanding the bits of judgement (or reprimand?) I am hearing, but I feel like everyone has to follow their own path. What works for you, might not work for me, and vise versa. I went to AA meetings and it depressed me so much that I went home immediately and drank. Over and over. That doesn't help me at all. I am not saying AA meetings don't work, just that it is not the right area for me. I respect how all of you choose to be sober, and ask hopefully for the same.

I am a writer, and in many ways an introvert. Writing is the most cathartic thing there is for me. I have one week sober today. That is the most I have had in a decade, and it is because of my blog. Yes AA is about anonymity, but my blog and my picture and my name create accountability for me. Not only that, but literally dozens of people have written to me telling me how they appreciate it because they have felt similar things, but been too ashamed to admit it, felt alone, or were not sure what to do. I don't care if people know that I need help. I'm asking for it. And I want to use what I'm learning to help anyone and everyone that I can. I guess I don't see anything wrong with that.

As far as the other blogger, that's fine. He was him, and I am me. You can't compare people any more than you can compare snowflakes. Oh ye of little faith.

God Bless.

-- Edited by Angel T on Sunday 7th of November 2010 07:37:45 PM

-- Edited by Angel T on Sunday 7th of November 2010 07:39:00 PM

dale63 · Member

Just remember the doors of AA are always open. Good luck to you.

LinBaba · MIP Old Timer

Angel T wrote:
I respect how all of you choose to be sober, and ask hopefully for the same.

Absolutely

However I would like to point out those Big Red letters at the Top of this Forum

Alcoholics Anonymous Group
Message Board

so if you get people pushing the "AA Agenda" here it might be because it's an AA forum, so you gonna get people telling you to do AA things

the second thing is we ALL have tried innumerable ways to get sober before finally ending up in AA, AA is the last door on the last house, on the last street, and that street is dead end, so the folks here have tried every imaginable way to get sober you can think of, and then some, and nothing worked for them until they went to AA and worked the steps, so while you will get support, you may also get some amused scepticism, while 7 days is great, the truth is it isn't very long in the big scheme of things, and that's not to minimize an incredible accomplishment, but you are talking to people who measure their sobriety by years and decades, albeit "one day at a time"

So if what you do doesn't work, our doors are always open, and while we are happy to hear how you are doing and welcome you to our community, be aware that some people are going to react to your not attending meetings like you would be viewed bringing bacon into a synagogue

personally I like bacon, but sometimes discretion is the better part of valor

Angel T wrote:
Not only that, but literally dozens of people have written to me telling me how they appreciate it because they have felt similar things, but been too ashamed to admit it, felt alone, or were not sure what to do.

You can't compare people any more than you can compare snowflakes. Oh ye of little faith.

Dozens is good

maybe to help put it in perspective we have 10's of millions that all felt exactly as you do at one point and learned to their detriment, and death in some cases that we are not all in fact "beautiful and unique snowflakes" but actually suffer from the disease of alcoholism, a disease characterized by certain recognizable signs and symptoms such as denial, delusion, and "terminal uniqueness"

Every single one of us walked through that door thinking we were unique, which lasted only a short time until we heard every single person in the room was exactly like us

Alcoholic

Perhaps this link will help, some fairly sharp cookies have been studying the alcohol thing for quite awhile

The first casualty of addiction, like that of war, is the truth. At first the addict merely denies the truth to himself. But as the addiction, like a malignant tumor, slowly and progressively expands and invades more and more of the healthy tissue of his life and mind and world, the addict begins to deny the truth to others as well as to himself. He becomes a practiced and profligate liar in all matters related to the defense and preservation of his addiction, even though prior to the onset of his addictive illness, and often still in areas as yet untouched by the addiction, he may be scrupulously honest.

First the addict lies to himself about his addiction, then he begins to lie to others. Lying, evasion, deception, manipulation, spinning and other techniques for avoiding or distorting the truth are necessary parts of the addictive process. They precede the main body of the addiction like military sappers and shock troops, mapping and clearing the way for its advance and protecting it from hostile counterattacks.

Because addiction by definition is an irrational, unbalanced and unhealthy behavior pattern resulting from an abnormal obsession, it simply cannot continue to exist under normal circumstances without the progressive attack upon and distortion of reality resulting from the operation of its propaganda and psychological warfare brigades. The fundamentally insane and unsupportable thinking and behavior of the addict must be justified and rationalized so that the addiction can continue and progress.

One of the chief ways the addiction protects and strengthens itself is by a psychology of personal exceptionalism which permits the addict to maintain a simultaneous double-entry bookkeeping of addictive and non-addictive realities and to reconcile the two when required by reference to the unique, special considerations that àat least in his own mind- happen to apply to his particular case.

The form of the logic for this personal exceptionalism is:

Under ordinary circumstances and for most people X is undesirable/irrational;

My circumstances are not ordinary and I am different from most people;

Therefore X is not undesirable/irrational in my case - or not as undesirable/irrational as it would be in other cases.
Armed with this powerful tool of personal exceptionalism that is a virtual "Open Sesame" for every difficult ethical conundrum he is apt to face, the addict is free to take whatever measures are required for the preservation and progress of his addiction, while simultaneously maintaining his allegiance to the principles that would certainly apply if only his case were not a special one.
In treatment and rehabilitation centers this personal exceptionalism is commonly called "terminal uniqueness." The individual in the grip of this delusion is able to convince himself though not always others that his circumstances are such that ordinary rules and norms of behavior, rules and norms that he himself concurs with when it comes to other people, do not fairly or fully fit himself at the present time and hence must be bent or stretched just sufficiently to make room for his special needs. In most cases this plea for accommodation is acknowledged to be a temporary one and accompanied by a pledge or plan to return to the conventional "rules of engagement" as soon as circumstances permit

-- Edited by LinBaba on Sunday 7th of November 2010 09:42:16 PM

pinkchip · MIP Old Timer

AA should give you hope not make you depressed. Sounds like you went to some jacked up meetings. Good luck reinventing the wheel though. Seriously...good luck cuz I hate to see someone suffer from ongoing alcoholism while thinking AA doesn't work and that they already tried it the way it was supposed to work.

P.S. - Please go to my new site IliketostirthepotandcreatecontroversyunnecessarillyandIamtoouniqueandspecialtodothingsthewayanordinarypersondoesthem.com

Angel T · Member

Fine I'll leave.

Angel T · Member

And by the way pinkchip, that was really rude. I am trying to get better, and help others. I thought that's what this was all about. My mistake.

angelov8 · MIP Old Timer

Linbaba, where did that info regarding the tradition of anonymity above come from? Specifically the thing marked 11). Nevermind, I got a spark and checked the BB-longform of tradition 11!

There's been some info passed around the rooms lately from GSO, I think on anonymity and the internet. I was wondering if anyone is familiar with it.

StPeteDean · MIP Old Timer

Angel T wrote:

Fine I'll leave.

Angel, you were never really here. You started 2 threads and posted your blog. You asked for help and didn't like the text book advise that was given. My hope is that you're not an alcoholic, but just someone that drank too much for awhile and can walk away. As was said many of us tried to get sober on our own and failed repeatedly hence we gave AA a solid chance and worked it the way the program was intended. Most of the members responding in your thread have years/decades of sobriety and have seen 1000's of "unique" individuals just like yourself (were all unique lol), but we're more alike than we are different as alcoholics, and I hope that you don't find that out the hard way. But if you do, we're here for you. Take a look at chapter 5 from the Big Book before you go so you'll have an idea of what we've been suggesting.

Chapter 5
How It Works

Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program, usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves. There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way. They are naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty. Their chances are less than average.

There are those, too, who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders, but many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest.

Our stories disclose in a general way what we used to be like, what happened, and what we are like now. If you have decided you want what we have and are willing to go to any length to get it -- then you are ready to take certain steps.

At some of these we balked. Thought we could find an easier, softer way. But we could not. With all the earnestness at our command, we beg of you to be fearless and thorough from the very start. Some of us have tried to hold on to our old ideas and the result was nil until we let go absolutely.

Remember that we deal with alcohol, cunning, baffling, powerful! Without help it is too much for us. But there is One who has all power that One is God. May you find Him now!

Half measures availed us nothing. We stood at the turning point. We asked His protection and care with complete abandon.

Here are the steps we took, which are suggested as a program of recovery:

We admitted we were powerless over alcohol, that our lives had become unmanageable.
Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.
Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

Many of us exclaimed, "What an order! I can't go through with it." Do not be discouraged. No one among us has been able to maintain anything like perfect adherence to these principles. We are not saints. The point is, that we are willing to grow along spiritual lines. The principles we have set down are guides to progress. We claim spiritual progress rather than spiritual perfection.

Our description of the alcoholic, the chapter to the agnostic, and our personal adventure before and after make clear three pertinent ideas:

	(a)	That we were alcoholic and could not manage our own lives.
	(b)	That probably no human power could have relieved our alcoholism.
	(c)	That God could and would if He were sought.

-- Edited by StPeteDean on Monday 8th of November 2010 05:57:23 AM

StPeteDean · MIP Old Timer

By the way, I've been to lots of meetings in your area (since 1989) and there are great meetings there with very upbeat successful people. The south bay alano club in Hermosa is awesome. I particularly enjoyed the early morning meeting (7am?). I randomly mentioned that it was my 3rd anniversary in that meeting and they had a cake in the refrigerator, pulled it out and we had a party lol. Quite a few celebrities in that meeting. I sat between a TV actor and a HOF baseball legend. A producer was trying to recruit me for a movie the following week (he liked my tan lol) but I was going back home. If you hit a depressing meeting, then you need to find some others to try. I live at the beach in FL and enjoy my on the beach meetings. After the morning meetings we generally go out for breakfest afterwards.

LinBaba · MIP Old Timer

Angel T wrote:
Over Halloween weekend, I behaved as I normally do, drinking, smoking, becoming supremely inebriated, going to sleep, waking up in agony, and repeating. I managed to get so drunk on Sunday night that I ended up waking up in a strange mansion in Laguna Beach with a group of people I had no memory of meeting. Upon posting this news on my facebook page, I received a comment from an old friend. She said, "It's good to see time hasn't changed you." Now the remark was off the cuff, and meant to be funny, but it shook me. Had I really not changed in ten years? Was I still living the life I did at sixteen?

Over the last ten years my life has certainly been through it's ups and downs, but alcohol has been a constant. Sadly, it has been one of the only constants. I have wished for changes in my life and my relationships so many times, yet never changed the party aspect of my life. What's the definition of insanity again?

Now I was never one of those people who missed work because of drinking, drank during the day, or drank and drove, so I decided I was a responsible drinker. I would only get wasted on my time, and never put anyone else in jeopardy. I guess I didn't realize that the one I've been putting in jeopardy is me.

In ten years I don't know that I've gone more than a couple of days without drinking. I can't imagine the kind of damage I've done to my body and my brain. I have decided I will not consume any alcohol until New Year's Eve 2010. I will reevaluate at the end of December.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now that the celebrating is done, I feel compelled to remind myself that I have eleven weeks left.

I feel confident today. I got through my first weekend without any hiccups. I am questioning how I even feel about addiction. Last night two of my friends drank wine in front of me, and I wasn't even fazed. I felt more of an urge for a smoke, but only briefly, and then that subsided. I don't know, maybe addiction is just in our heads and the only thing we truly need is a desire to stop.

Angel, A few things, hopefully they will help

First we don't come to AA to go on the wagon for a few weeks, because that doesn't work

What's the definition of insanity again? You wrote it yourself

One of the characteristics of alcoholism is the inability to remember the suffering of a month, or even a week ago when it's time to pick up a drink, instead of saying to ourselves "Oh look, it's a hot stove, that will burn me" we say "It will be different this time and here's how"

THAT"S the insanity

after just a week you are questioning your ideas on addiction, thinking you were imagining how bad it was, the next step in that process is taking a drink since it is now "under control"

So you are taking a few weeks off drinking before plunging back in...well good, my experience is that alcohol would "rubber band" on me, when I "went on the wagon" when I returned to alcohol it would punish me for leaving it and in a short time I would be worse off then ever

So when you go back to drinking, and it grabs you by the throat and throws you around like a rag doll in a pit bulls mouth and you are utterly helpless in it's grip, and make no mistake, you will be, I'd say within 90 days of you reading this you will be helpless in alcohols grip wondering how it happened, I'd like you to think of this conversation you had with people that know how to quit drinking and wanted to help you

Anyhow, good luck, when it goes bad, come back, we will be here for you with unconditional love actually, because we all tried what you are trying, and there is a reason we are all saying the same thing

We all found out the hard way it didn't work

this was written in the 30's

by a man

Chapter 3 - More About Alcoholism

Most of us have been unwilling to admit we were real alcoholics. No person likes to think he is bodily and mentally different from his fellows. Therefore, it is not surprising that our drinking careers have been characterized by countless vain attempts to prove we could drink like other people. The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death.
We learned that we had to fully concede to our innermost selves that we were alcoholics. This is the first step in recovery. The delusion that we are like other people, or presently may be, has to be smashed.
We alcoholics are men and women who have lost the ability to control our drinking. We know that no real alcoholic ever recovers control. All of us felt at times that we were regaining control, but such intervals usually brief were inevitably followed by still less control, which led in time to pitiful and incomprehensible demoralization. We are convinced to a man that alcoholics of our type are in the grip of a progressive illness. Over any considerable period we get worse, never better.
We are like men who have lost their legs; they never grow new ones. Neither does there appear to be any kind of treatment which will make alcoholics of our kind like other men. We have tried every imaginable remedy. In some instances there has been brief recovery, followed always by a still worse relapse. Physicians who are familiar with alcoholism agree there is no such thing a making a normal drinker out of an alcoholic. Science may one day accomplish this, but it hasn't done so yet.
Despite all we can say, many who are real alcoholics are not going to believe they are in that class. By every form of self- deception and experimentation, they will try to prove themselves exceptions to the rule, therefore nonalcoholic. If anyone who is showing inability to control his drinking can do the right-about- face and drink like a gentleman, our hats are off to him. Heaven knows, we have tried hard enough and long enough to drink like other people!
Here are some of the methods we have tried: Drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums we could increase the list ad infinitum.
We do not like to pronounce any individual as alcoholic, but you can quickly diagnose yourself, step over to the nearest barroom and try some controlled drinking. Try to drink and stop abruptly. Try it more than once. It will not take long for you to decide, if you are honest with yourself about it. It may be worth a bad case of jitters if you get a full knowledge of your condition.
Though there is no way of proving it, we believe that early in our drinking careers most of us could have stopped drinking. But the difficulty is that few alcoholics have enough desire to stop while there is yet time. We have heard of a few instances where people, who showed definite signs of alcoholism, were able to stop for a long period because of an overpowering desire to do so

-- Edited by LinBaba on Monday 8th of November 2010 09:05:11 AM

pinkchip · MIP Old Timer

The ego needs to be smashed and rebuilt in order to stay sober. Hey, I got told to take my therapist hat off and start listening to others when I first went to AA. Of course I was brutally offended at the time, but in actuality, I now know that it was coming from people that knew I was spouting a lot of junk that I didn't know anything about (I still do that sometimes). Anyhow Angel, you shared the link to your blog several times. On like the 5th time, it seemed like self promoting and not asking for help. This is an AA site and I come here to hear how others are working their AA program or to give hope to folks that think they might need AA. I'm sorry for being mean but sometimes there is not a nice way to tell someone what they need to hear.

By the way, the concept of being "terminally unique" is pretty common to alcoholics, particulary those new in sobriety. I'm sorry I brought it up in a rude way, but I didn't make it up and what I was trying to get across is that you seem to be a shining example of this. Furthermore, the little bits you wrote here tell me exactly why AA didn't work for you. You can't stand hearing anything you don't like. I know what that is like cuz I'm the same way, but I acknowledge it and am working on it.

I think the writing is a great idea, but do it for yourself and go get all the help that is out there for your alcoholism. If you had cancer would you have so much hubris to think you could blog yourself healthy while rejecting chemo and radiation as "not for you?"

Rainspa · Senior Member

Angel T wrote:

Fine I'll leave.

Oh my. This is known as a "Flounce". "Angel, you were never really here." Well said.

If you haven't done the steps, you haven't done AA.
But you can do it, if you want to. We'll keep the coffee pot on.

dale63 · Member

Its is also based on attraction. Some of what is above would not attract me. But this is the Internet and is to be expected. Some of the above that is most inspiring as well.

pinkchip · MIP Old Timer

Yeah. I agree with that Dale. However when people put themselves way out there, they are asking for the feedback. It's not the same as being mean to a person with 7 days sober sitting at a meeting that already has stated they want the program and want your help. It's not the same as someone that is even confused and wondering what to do next.

But yeah...I suppose I could be a better example of the program by not being nasty and sarcastic with such folks.