How long, on avarage do you think it should take to complete the steps?......And what about step 4, how do you know what to include or leave out? I was just reading on another thread how we should "keep it simple", sometimes I think I dwell on things too much, or analyse stuff to death.
Should the steps be done as a matter of urgency, or should we keep it simple and allow things to happen over time?
Aloha Brandy...Only my own experience. Don't procrastinate too long cause this is a life threatening disease. My experience is time taking because of the type of personality I was. I came into recovery unconvinced and oppositional and defiant so I fought the program and then went to college to make sure I was getting the right stuff inside of the program and then I kinda, sorta started working it as suggested. No two of us are alike and I was glad to have patient sponsorship (which is what I am like today) who continued to be there for me when I made a decision and then wanted to follow thru on it. I didn't drink and kept coming back which were the first two suggestions given to me. So I really did follow thru on those two right away.
If you got a sponsor...use that sponsor and practice humility as best you can. Humility for me today is "being teachable". Just show up for the lessons with and open mind and the willingness to be led.
"We are not saints, neither are we perfect". (((hugs)))
Hi Jerry, I don't have a sponsor, I stopped going to AA a long time ago but I'm thinking of going back because I feel I need a programme of recovery. I find it hard to get past the defiant stage though!! There was a time when I did, and I did what was suggested and joined a Big Book Group and went through the programme rapidly with two different sponsors. I felt worse after it. Didn't feel any great spiritual things happening. I think it was too rushed. I started doing the steps with a third sponsor (To step 5) but this sponsor was too rigid,it was a very in depth way of doing things, dealing with the spiritual malady. I could only go to meetings that he approved, and I had to get his permission to talk at meetings among other strict rules. It sounds almost unbelievable now that I put up with that!! Although he was in AA he was part of another movement which is infiltrating AA. Although we're from UK his sponsor was in America. I found it to be very cult like so I fled. The craziest thing is though, its the closest I felt to a spiritual experience at one point.
Having said that I had been in and out of AA for years just attending meetings and staying away from the first drink, which had also been suggested, but that didn't do anything great for me either (spiritually speaking).
I think I need somewhere in between. A sponsor who is working the steps (but not religious ) and believes in the programme and also believes in AA as a fantastic support group.
I just read that back..........how confusingno wonder I don't know if I'm coming or going at times!!
Nice to meet you.There are different ideas for different 12 step programs.In AA it is suggested you get thru your steps much quicker than in some other fellowships that prefers your first year is a gift and steps are worked slowly.I also attended program early in my recovery(dec/84 after 25 years of addiction)when my first sponsor died(2 years later)(very gruff,hard core,used to yell and swear at me all the time,etc) I went my own way staying abstinent, but not working recovery .For me, they are 2 separate entities.Though I was remaining sober my life was overun with character defects and as moving toward spiritual bankruptcy, and like we say sober time don't equal recovery. When I came back to process ,got another sponsor,worked my steps methodically and to best of my ability ,did service and gAve back and continue to give back,what was so freely given to me,My life began to flourish.Being and working recovery,one day at a time,staying in the "solution"the steps and being totally guided by my higher power ,I have been able to reach a place never achieved just by abstinence. We are all different but this is my story. I also early on had thoughts of cultish behavior,poor success rates ,other things I didn't like,but when I got honest with myself, took what I needed and left the rest until I was ready for it,I found that this worked best for me.I do believe,for me,working a next step before you can fully incorporate the previous step doesn't present the best scenario(for me)..For example,.Our second step tells us "that this step is necessary to achieve ongoing recovery. Many passed over it with a minimum of concern only to find out next steps wouldn't work. If I cannot honestly come up with my own concept of this power greater than myself,,it will be very difficult to turn my will and lives over to care of it!(3rd)... This is where the honesty ,openmindedness and willingness enter in to allow us to 'incorporate the steps in our lives. All of the literature and words are "meaningless' unless the change in our lives show it.Can't share sober and live dirty...Writings tell us "that we were in the grip of a hopeless dilemma ,the solution of which is spiritual in nature.For sure,bottom line is we can "never take that first drink again"but the joys of "recovery" compared to just abstinence,are light years apart for me!Nice talking with you and I wish you a productive journey on your road to continued,uninterrupted sobriety!!!
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Selfishness-self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles.
Thanks Mike, I really appreciate you all taking the time to respond to me.
Mike, I didn't mean that AA was the cult, its a programme that is being worked within AA. It's called "stepnahead" into emotional sobriety, looks very appealling at first. The guy that started it is called Wayne B. He does conventions and stuff. This may work for some, but it wasn't for me.
OH thanks I must have read over too quickly,but my firsat impressions were that it was cultish!!! of course still somewhat in denial and not really teachable yet!!! thanks for sharing talk to you ......
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Selfishness-self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles.
Aloha again Brandy...By keeping openminded and listening deeply I arrived at the awareness of my oppositional defiance and then arrived at the emotion that drove it which was/is fear. (That one is in the big book also). Fear of course also drove my last of trust and other defects such as procrastination and apathy. In one of my 4th steps (I did 6 so don't worry about speed with this fellow) I arrived at fear being my greatest emotional character defect and when I got that one I knew what to wish for Christmas from my HP. I was ready for it to go and it went..."Free at last, Free at last...thank God I'm free at last!"
I also found the "permissions" like Mike mentioned...the permission to take what I like and leave the rest for later or never. I learned grace giving...having compassion and open forgiveness for others in the fellowship with their own character defects like I also wanted for my self. I've been around a long time and have never found a perfect recovering fellow including myself...I have a home group that will openly remind me when I am not (lol!!) for which I am and they are grateful...we do not take each other seriously but with unconditional love.
Cult and Religious? Yeah those subjects did come up for me when I first got into the programs. I got into Al-Anon and then AA. I was leary of cult and religion because those where huge irritations and fears during the drinking years. What alcoholic suffering a hang over would want to suffer a preacher at the same time. I rejected when it was done to me and had a bible thrown at me by my alcoholic wife when I tried to do it to her...Doesn't work without awareness and willingness.
Religion...religiously there is a huge difference for me. I was born and raised Roman Catholic which came with my Portugese heritage from which I was also born and raised alcoholic...hmmmm I practiced both and neither came close to saving my spiritual self. Then I heard at a meeting..."We are not a religion but if you practice these steps religiously"...daily, 24/7, mind, body, spirit and emotions; you will gain relief. That was one of my first AHAs!!...a bit tricky and requiring trust but doable at least for the first 90 days which I did 102 meetings in. The program was right and I do the steps and more religiously. The and more part is the spiritual characteristics of the slogans, restored characters of sanity and serenity and those tools necessary to be here.
So that is part of the whole of my journey. Check out fear and don't be afraid to check it out or of what you find...take it slow and discover the one person you've lived your entire life with and didn't know much about...you.
By the way there are sooo many organizations and individuals who are putting extra mileage on the 12steps that anyone watching the phenomenom would have to say this is a powerful way of living. Indeed. Don't even be afraid of them.
no wonder I don't know if I'm coming or going at times!!