Crappy Halloween

Aquaman · MIP Old Timer

Crappy Halloween

SteveP · MIP Old Timer

You could be describing my life, lol!

Yeah, I really, really, really stuggle with the doormat issue too.

Your sponsor sounds awesome. What's he saying about the doormat issue?

Also, I think that the personal inventory part of Step 10 is looking to our part in things and ultimately why we are disturbed.. and making an appropriate amend where we have had some wrong part in it and asking for the resentment, fear, etc. to be removed -- not totally letting somebody walk over us.

And you know one of the coolest things about your post: you said that you didn't drink. Works for me.

Steve

Carlotta · Veteran Member

Hi Rob:
You've done a good thing in posting those feelings; I think your wife needs to be "called up" on this self-centered behavior; sounds to me she's "milking the victim" role in this relationship and not getting the help she needs (& you're paying a price for that). I remember being reeled in many times for this behavior with my recovering alcoholic husband realizing his 12 Steps had me over a barrel and I did not have the right to that controlling self centered attitude. I know we can only change ourselves but I feel your frustration, I'm sure you'll receive good wisdom from others on the board. You are in my prayers!!
Take care!
Carlotta

-- Edited by Carlotta on Sunday 1st of November 2009 07:52:33 AM

pinkchip · MIP Old Timer

The spiritual axiom says we leave anger to those better suited to handle it basically. This does not mean to be a doormat. It just means don't be a screaming ranting rageaholic. I went off at work on Thursday. Been pondering it...have some resentments...but I am human. I will do lots of stupid things in sobriety and have done many of them already this year. Rob, even if your wife doesn't go to Alanon, she will adjust to the new you and the principles by which you are living your life. I guess what you can do is voice your disagreement without getting in major arguments or feeling totally angry and slighted. If she brings it to that level, it's on her and the best you can do is let it go. If she is acting totally loony, you do have a right to point that out. You are 50 percent of the partnership and the parenthood. It would seem that it's too easy to think that cuz of all the years our families put up with our drunkeness, that we should be groveling and kissing their butt forever. No...with sobriety we get to have the relationships God wants us to have...and God does not want us to be miserable, feel miserable, be doormats, or be angry self-righteous A-holes...just how I view it. I guess it's all about balance Rob. It kind of does sound like you struck balance and it's just that it didn't feel good. You stuck to your morals and didn't all the way cave in, but also did not get into a massive argument when it was all said and done...and like Steve said....You stayed sober! There's probably a lot of changes going on here. I am betting in years past, she could do whatever she wanted with the kids and you would be like "Okay"...back to drinking. Not saying you were not a good dad, but I'm wondering if you being a more active and invested parent is irksome to her, even though she probably said a gazillion times in the past she wished you would stop drinking so you both could have that... People wish for stuff and they they don't like all the ramifications that occur when they get what they want. In either case, incredibly awesome job getting through the holiday. Care to hazzard a guess how many people probably fell off the wagon last night? Thank God it wasn't you right?

Mark

Toad · Senior Member

Hello Aguaman,
Very good share. Funny how I trust your latest share more than I do the flowers and butterflies. Might be cause' My recovery never once stayed flowers and butterflies.
Clean and sober slowly started removing ILLUSIONS.
I hung on for dear life to the slogan "To Thine Own Self Be True". That was not often "pretty"
The Steps and other honest recovering people helped me figure out who I actually was. After all those years of drinking and drugging I Lost Myself. So being true to myself became a process of Trial and Error. At times it still is. I am finding out what my rigth size is and ways to communicate that to others. At times they do not like that. Wah --Wah !!
I cannot afford to use. I believe this recovery is My Last Shot at Life. I cannot convince myself I could find my way back. F**k, I do not really rember the track of getting here in the first place.
I think you are doing just fine.

Not for light weights,
Toad

jj · MIP Old Timer

hi Aquaman, thank you for talking about honest feelings. i made myself a doormat because in my relationship it was all about doing the easiest thing. it takes hard work to set boundaries with spouse, kids, parents, and former drinking buddies.
i am worth more to me now than when i was when i was soused. i stayed drunk to avoid taking control of my life. it was everyone elses fault they treated me like poop. last week when my hubby was on a screaming rant where i usually cringe or "react" i just told my HP i do not know how to deal him when he does that. i had been praying about this for months.... i didn't react and i just prayed. when he finally got wound down i told him that was unacceptable behavior. in 20 years i have never been able to voice that thought. HP calmed my heart and the words came out. hubby has not done it since, but i know how to deal with it now and those words are my mantra. "that is not acceptable behavior" and "let's discuss this after we take a time out" can help us think clearly about doing the next right thing. we are not doormats, we are lovely, loving people who want relationships to be healthy and grow.
hugs and prayers, dear.

bikerbill · MIP Old Timer

Aquaman wrote: Bill replies in italics

It was good. Especially the part in step 10 about whenever someone wrongs to us, we're defective, too...or something to that effect. I just don't buy it 100%.

I don't think we're menat to believe we're totally defective, just that our reactions to others are coloured by our defects, our responses are shaped by new eirience, knowledge and character attributes.

Continued to take a personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it, doesn't this mean we take care of our wrongs without assuming responsibility for every other bugger's wrongs?
This morning, we talked it out and like a good little Alkie I took all the blame.

Why? Why take all the blame, is your wife a saint, an angel? Take her off the pedestal man.

Is the price for sobriety in the program always going to be rolling over and being everybody else's pissing-pot?

No it certanly isn't but at times it feels like it. As time goes by and as we grow we realise that yep, there are people who behave inappropriately. Our challenge is to respond appropriately

If I am forced to take the blame for everybody else's character defects for the rest of my sober life, then I want out.

See above, we sweep our side of the street, we don't cross the raod and sweep every other buggers street for them.
Needless to say, The Wife is now pissed at me again and my explanation did not diffuse her.
Well, I'm not a saint. I claim spiritual progress, rather than spiritual perfection. I'm not the Dalai Lama, or Jesus. I'm out of cheeks. F*** It. My kids had a nice Halloween, I'm not drunk and I'm not gonna fall on my sword this time.

Hey, your kids had a good time, you didn't have a drink - how much better an it get? Your wife hasn't filed for divorce, run off with the milkman or planted a steak knife in your ribs, sounds like you aren't doing too badly.

My course of action is to take no action. I will continue this path and gain wisdom as I go. The promises will come true. To drink is to die, and where there is life, there is hope.

Hey that sounds really positive. Out of pain comes growth.

Sh**. I'm still kinda bent-up. I wish my Mom was still alive so I could call her and ask "Mom, why is it that women are beautiful AND bat-sh*t crazy?"

Hmm. I made myself smile. That'll do for now.

Rob

ljc · MIP Old Timer

Everything was fine until the wife wanted you, her and the kids to be together. Whats wrong with that ? Why didnt you just do what she asked ? Can you imagine what the outcome of that would have been ?

I remember so many times in my early days sober (I was still so selfish and self centered ) I figured since I was getting sober that I should be treated like some sort of Queen and my husband should cow-tow to me . I mean, after all , doesn't he know how hard this is for me to get sober and not drink ? NO, he doesn't know how difficult it is. He has no program and I do.

It took me a long time to finally figure it out that this sickness of alcoholism affects everyone involved. Its not just about me.
I asked my husband to read Chapter to Wives, and he did. Did it do either of us any good, Im not sure.

Families are bound to go thru so many changes when an alcoholic gets sober. I did, and so did we as a family . Even my grown kids and I together have gone thru changes, and they dont live with me.
Its all very normal and to be expected I think that ppl are gonna get on others nerves. Key is not to get drunk over it . Cuz Lord knows I spent ALOT of time doing that. Key is to admit my faults and not point fingers, keep my side of the street clean.
My husband ( and family members ) continued to love and care for me thru my drunkeness . Hubby never gave me my walking papers and God knows I deserved them for some of the horrible stuff I did.
Does this mean, Im suppose to suck up and kiss butt ? No, it means for me that I remember that Im in AA to live a better life and grow up !! It means that Ive finally learned how to care for myself and like Me, and its time to start sharing that with my husband and my family. Does it mean Im suppose to be a doormat to them for all Ive done wrong,? NO. I made my ammends, and now I should continue to love them and give them the respect they deserve as human beings.

Step 12 says to practice these principles in ALL my affairs. and practicing them at home is the hardest place to do that. But practice I must or I'll be miserable. And I didnt get sober to be miserable .
Does this mean I may have to go on an outing or to an event I might not be so happy about ? Yes it does.

Because my sponsor told me when I was about 3 yrs sober that this is how it should be for me ....
God, Family, AA. and in that order.
And this is the way it is for me today.

I saw a post on here a couple weeks ago, and remember a sentence in it very well.
1st year we dry up, 2nd year we sober up, and the rest of the years we grow up.
How true, for me anyways.

I do a 10th step inventory every night. I know when I have hurt somebody with my words or actions. Id better be willing to make ammends if they are due. Hangin onto bad stuff in my head will kill me.

pinkchip · MIP Old Timer

Good post LJC...a perspective I didn't consider but certainly on the money in many ways. I do know that for this entire year I have spent so much time thinking about me me me me me...so what you said about being very self-absorbed in the first year is true. I still have a lot of problems removing myself and my ego from situations and seeing other people's view points. This is disturbing to me since im a freaking therapist. I know to be attentive and do that when I'm sitting down and doing a session, but...on my own...that is a different story. Thanks for your wisdom.

jasperkent · Senior Member

Rob, good for you. You stayed sober and you decided to talk about it rather than bottling it up. (no pun intended)

Many very good points already made here. Lots of food for thought.

My personal opinion(I do not represent AA as a whole) is that we are NOT meant to be doormats. We ARE supposed to remember that everyone, including ourselves, is to some degree emotionally ill. To deal with this fact we must practice patience, tolerance, and acceptance. This does not mean we have to like all behaviors or approve of all attitudes. It just means we need to do our best to live by the Serenity Prayer. Sometimes it's a balancing act.

It has been my experience that when an alcoholic spouse gets sober, the relationship changes dramatically. Previously, everyone's attention was focused on the alcoholic's drinking and its consequences. Remove the alcohol. Now other problems fill the vacuum, some that were never before acknowledged. If the nonalcoholic spouse enjoyed the codependent role, there will be huge problems. I had two relationships end because of this. In both cases, I got sober and suddenly they didn't like me as much nor did I like them as much. Ironically, I got drunk over both break-ups!

Rob, I am NOT suggesting that this will happen to you. I AM saying that things do not suddenly get better in every way just because you are in recovery. Your relationship will grow...and growth is usually painful.

I pray that your wife will give Alanon a try.

Thank you all for letting me share.

turninggrey · MIP Old Timer

Hey AM,
Being sober will eventually lead you into confidence in your actions. You will have years of being honest and you will have a track record with your self. Right now, your wife has only seen months of your new track record. There will be doubts on both sides. Give it time. The concept of sobriety is based on humility and service, but not on being a door mat. When the confidence comes, lead. Your wife will follow. When your wife is right, let her lead. You will find the right combination.
Tom