Hey all, sorry haven't been here in while. What a great board.
Could use some advice from you guys about how to deal with my alcoholic selfishness.
To cut a long story short, I'm originally from Canada and have lived the last 17 years in England. I came over with my girlfriend who went to university over here I guess that I've never felt happy here and miss my mom and sisters and friends back home. I've never really made any friends here. From day 1 I was looking to go home.
Selfishness, passive aggressiveness, guilt, dishonesty, pride and fear of returning home made me stay here with my girlfriend, whom I married, even though I cheated on here a bit when drunk (before and after marriage). Deep down, I never loved her, I liked her a lot, but that was it. But I kept digging in deeper: we bought at house add now have a wonderful little son, 3 and a half.
I never did much with my career, was either too drunk, too lazy, too arrogant, etc. to do much about it. I drank to escape the marriage and my life here. I tried and failed at about 100 hobbies along the way, to escape.
Anyway, I'm still obsessing with the idea of going home, with or without the family. I rationalize that if she really loves me and wants what's best for our son, she'll come back with me.
She says that she won't. If I go back, it's solo.
I've been working with a sponsor for a while now and am on step 4. He rightly says that this is a bit of an escape fantasy.
Part of me knows that all of those defects of character are in full play here, but part of me simply can't cope with the prospect of spending the rest of my life here, feeling so alien, my mom dying (she's getting older and has been under a lot of stress with a divorce from my stepdad) while I'm here, my sisters getting older, friends dying etc. I guess deep down, I *know* that I'll drink on this in the long run.
I've prayed like crazy about it, but it just won't go. I know that insisting we go home and going home either way is terribly selfish, but I can't get past it.
Can anyone suggest how to go forward with this. I just don't want to drink again and I don't want to live only by self-centredness, but I can't get past this.
Well, I think the thoughts or fantasy as you say is there for good reason and you are not off base or totally selfish here in what you have stated. You are just bringing up a hefty change that you might want to make a little bit too early on. You have started to accumulate some sober time right? You are starting to see things a bit more clearly and this is one of those things. It might seem like the clock is ticking for you to make a choice, but it can wait a little bit until your sobriety is more stable. When the time is right, you will actually know that you WONT drink over it...no matter what. There is never a good reason to end your sobriety or make yourself start over again so don't let that train even get off the track. I guess the point I'm making here is that you have good reasons to consider the move, but I would wait til at least a year sober. With that said, I did not take all suggestions to wait a year before certain changes. I started a relationship...but I also paid a price for that in terms of going crazy over it and being all needy in it and slowing my own growth down. It was a trade off...but I didn't and haven't drank over it. So...I don't think you are being selfish, just complicating things a little too much at this stage of the game. Be aware...this is coming from a person who can and will complicate 1 plus 1 if given the chance so really I am identifying with you as much as I am offering suggestion. Just don't wreck yourself with obsessing over it...your life doesn't depend on the move, but it does depend on you staying sober.
Mark
__________________
Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
Maybe life changing events should wait until you are further on in the programme. Beware of geographics. Beware of external fixes. Know that everyone you know will die someday and there is bugger all you can do about it. Talk to your sponsor about how you feel and why you feel and get to the bottom of the fears.
__________________
It's not having what you want, it's wanting what you got. BB
Thanks guys for the advice. You're right on the money, both of you. My sponsor is away at the mo, but I'll speak with him about this when I get back. I feel embarrassed to tell him (he's an American, has been here as long as I have and has thrived! but then again, he came over sober! :) ). Intellectually, part of me realizes that I just want quick geographical fixes. Heck, that's why I left home in the first place. Needless to say, part of me knows that within two weeks of landing back home, I'd be saying the exact opposite. And yeah, then my poor mom would see me get drunk again. Yep, that is *not* where I want to go.
Yep, I need to accept some of these things, *really* accept these things.
I tell you though, I get these moments of insight when I realize that this program really, really, really works.
After posting this, I thought to myself, what have I heard so much in the rooms and prayed a bit.
Do something for someone else. So I asked my wife if there was anything that I could do for her -- then I did the yard (some of you may be remember that I kind of have an aversion to yardwork ;). Then I went to a meeting.
I feel a different guy and will get through today now without picking up.
And thanks all for helping not to pick up that first drink.
Aloha Steve...Very closely shared experiences for me an my spouse. I was in the mainland for 17 years before acting on the message of my HP to come back where my spirit was created. A woman, now my wife, followed and is going thru the very strong feelings you are also going thru for some of the same reasons and more (new grandchildren). She is not a drinker soooo Why would drinking have to be a consequence to loneliness? I am the alcoholic in our relaltionship and quit the bottle before leaving blood and recovery family in the mainland. I was born and raised in Hawaii so leaving Central Valley California was not a loss for me.
There are tons of postential excuses out there for me to drink over and then today it would still be inspite of the awareness that there is only one reasons ever for me to drink and that is because I would want to and then have to except the consequences of the event. The last word of the 2nd step is sanity. I have no desire to willingly give that up today inspite of this disease occasionally notifying me that it is available and would like to reform our past relationship.
My spouse returns a few times a year to her home and family. That is what works for now and that is keeping with the awareness that I am done with the part of my life which included living in a place and culture that wasn't in keeping with my spiritual needs. As I know it, you have solutions including drinking. As I've been taught it in recovery...choose the consequence the most fits your needs first and then act on it. There will always be people who will agree and disagree and as I see it there are but three who are immediately affected by the situation, You Your wife and Your child. My earlier sponsor taught me that when I found out I had made a mistake, regardless of the size of it or the time since, I must go back and correct it as very best I could or continue to have my spirit suffer.
By the way, life back home has gone on pretty well without you also. You haven't said if they have been crying to have you back. Humbling.
Aloha Steve...Very closely shared experiences for me an my spouse. I was in the mainland for 17 years before acting on the message of my HP to come back where my spirit was created. A woman, now my wife, followed and is going thru the very strong feelings you are also going thru for some of the same reasons and more (new grandchildren). She is not a drinker soooo Why would drinking have to be a consequence to loneliness? I am the alcoholic in our relaltionship and quit the bottle before leaving blood and recovery family in the mainland. I was born and raised in Hawaii so leaving Central Valley California was not a loss for me.
There are tons of postential excuses out there for me to drink over and then today it would still be inspite of the awareness that there is only one reasons ever for me to drink and that is because I would want to and then have to except the consequences of the event. The last word of the 2nd step is sanity. I have no desire to willingly give that up today inspite of this disease occasionally notifying me that it is available and would like to reform our past relationship.
My spouse returns a few times a year to her home and family. That is what works for now and that is keeping with the awareness that I am done with the part of my life which included living in a place and culture that wasn't in keeping with my spiritual needs. As I know it, you have solutions including drinking. As I've been taught it in recovery...choose the consequence the most fits your needs first and then act on it. There will always be people who will agree and disagree and as I see it there are but three who are immediately affected by the situation, You Your wife and Your child. My earlier sponsor taught me that when I found out I had made a mistake, regardless of the size of it or the time since, I must go back and correct it as very best I could or continue to have my spirit suffer.
By the way, life back home has gone on pretty well without you also. You haven't said if they have been crying to have you back. Humbling.
(((((hugs)))))
Thanks JerryF, what a great post! :) One of the great things about the fellowship is that I now know that I am NEVER alone -- there is always someone in it who has had a similar experience...and gotten through it...and is willing to share on it. It's hard for me to express how much comfort that I draw from that.
Your comment on life going on back home without me is very insightful. My mom has had a really rough time recently (my step-dad has divorced her for another woman and has left her effectively destitute, while neither of my sisters, can really seem to help her out much: instead, she still thinks that she needs to help them out), but through the whole episode, she has said time and time again how proud she is of me of my life over here, how she tells all her friends, etc. And, even if I was there, there would have been nothing that I could have done about that. Even more, if I just pulled up sticks and went back over there and my wife said "see ya", well, I guess that she would feel that she had to help me out too! So indeed, she has *never* been crying to have me back. Good point!
Yes, you're right. I can always just go back to the barstool, like I did for so many years. Except now I have the full knowledge of what the consequences of that would be.
And I'm grateful for your sponsor's comment on the correcting mistakes if we can -- I never thought of it that way.
I suspect that I know what has raised these thoughts recently: we're having a terrible dispute with some builders who basically wrecked our home, and our lawyer never returns our calls. Panic cycle sets in...and no mystery now that the fantasy of starting all over again at the age of 42 back home crops up!
BTW: been to Hawaii only once. pre-sobriety. What a beautiful place. I can only imagine how much better that it is, sober! :)
-- Edited by SteveP on Monday 5th of October 2009 01:42:31 AM
Steve, I just wanted to add a couple ideas. When I stopped drinking, it took a really long time to get a grips on my worrying and obsessing over things. It is and was in my nature to be worried and to obsess over things, so without alcohol those things took off. I felt like all I could do was think about myself and it disturbed me how incredibly self-absorbed I was. I really didn't like that I could not stop thinking about myself and my life and I would get so twisted up in my own head. It typically did lead to me feeling bad about myself and hating parts of myself and the fact that I could not stop thinking about them. Coping skills were not there even though I knew all about "letting go" and the futility of worrying about things I couldn't control. I do know in retrospect, my disease was fighting hard to try and show me how complicated, unhappy, and messed up my life was so that I would go back to drinking over it because that is what I always did to escape those obsessive and worrisome thoughts. Most of the stuff I was so busy worrying about was made up in my head and I really feared going crazy. I kept coming to periodic epiphanies that I thought were "the answer" to most of my problems and then I would feel good for a few days before it was back to worrying and whatever I thought was "the answer" was not. In actuality...all those epiphanies were just part of a larger "answer" that is still unfolding and I am okay with it taking a little more time. The bigger issue for me is just accepting on a daily basis that things are okay and nothing is all that wrong. I think prayer is great, and I would just continue to pray for peace of mind and clarity and to stay sober....and for others of course. I am comparing this dilemma to the last time you posted here and your thoughts sound clearer and these obsessive thoughts are more grounded in reality than when you were literally worried that the cops were going to get you for putting lawn clippings in the wrong place. I am not making fun of you or trying to call you nuts in any way. I am just saying that this is exactly what I went through and slowly over time, the picture started clearing up to the point where it was pretty obvious to me that my thinking and obsessing was a bigger problem than any of the actual issues I was obsessing over. You sound like you are on the road to gaining more perspective and peace of mind and it is due to the program and staying sober. I just wanted to offer encouragement and to try and help you not go through all that obsessing and worrying that I did. The changes you want to happen are happening already and those are the ones you don't see so easily. Everything will turn out fine and all the important answers will be revealed to you without trying so hard. Try and go easy on yourself. I wish I had in retrospect.
Mark
__________________
Keep coming back. It works if you work it. So work it. You're worth it!
Steve, I just wanted to add a couple ideas. When I stopped drinking, it took a really long time to get a grips on my worrying and obsessing over things. It is and was in my nature to be worried and to obsess over things, so without alcohol those things took off. I felt like all I could do was think about myself and it disturbed me how incredibly self-absorbed I was. I really didn't like that I could not stop thinking about myself and my life and I would get so twisted up in my own head. It typically did lead to me feeling bad about myself and hating parts of myself and the fact that I could not stop thinking about them. Coping skills were not there even though I knew all about "letting go" and the futility of worrying about things I couldn't control. I do know in retrospect, my disease was fighting hard to try and show me how complicated, unhappy, and messed up my life was so that I would go back to drinking over it because that is what I always did to escape those obsessive and worrisome thoughts. Most of the stuff I was so busy worrying about was made up in my head and I really feared going crazy. I kept coming to periodic epiphanies that I thought were "the answer" to most of my problems and then I would feel good for a few days before it was back to worrying and whatever I thought was "the answer" was not. In actuality...all those epiphanies were just part of a larger "answer" that is still unfolding and I am okay with it taking a little more time. The bigger issue for me is just accepting on a daily basis that things are okay and nothing is all that wrong. I think prayer is great, and I would just continue to pray for peace of mind and clarity and to stay sober....and for others of course. I am comparing this dilemma to the last time you posted here and your thoughts sound clearer and these obsessive thoughts are more grounded in reality than when you were literally worried that the cops were going to get you for putting lawn clippings in the wrong place. I am not making fun of you or trying to call you nuts in any way. I am just saying that this is exactly what I went through and slowly over time, the picture started clearing up to the point where it was pretty obvious to me that my thinking and obsessing was a bigger problem than any of the actual issues I was obsessing over. You sound like you are on the road to gaining more perspective and peace of mind and it is due to the program and staying sober. I just wanted to offer encouragement and to try and help you not go through all that obsessing and worrying that I did. The changes you want to happen are happening already and those are the ones you don't see so easily. Everything will turn out fine and all the important answers will be revealed to you without trying so hard. Try and go easy on yourself. I wish I had in retrospect.
Mark
Hey Mark, thanks for posting this. Really helpful. I know deep down that I need to go easier on myself.
And yep, last time I was getting all paranoid about grass clippings, lol, and now it's about geographicals.
Huge amount of identification with periodic epiphanies. Early sobriety for me really has been a trip: riding the pink cloud for a while, falling off and hitting the ground hard, riding the pink cloud again for a little while, falling off again!
Really helpful indeed to know that I'm not alone in having this intense emotions during early sobriety and that we can get through these things. And what you say about obsessing over problems being the big problem itself is on the money: I guess in a sense, my disease is trying to trick me back into the "much easier" obsession with alcohol.
Above all, good to know that these do get more clear as we progress in sobriety.
Thanks Mark and all for helping to keep sober today.
You're a lucky man. Wife, son, the fellowship of AA and kabobs. Man, I miss kabobs. I live in Iowa and while I like things I can't get in the UK, like direct sunshine and cheap gasoline, I sure as heck miss kabobs. Any ethnic food for that matter. Here "ethnic" is Americanized Chinese and Mexican with the occassional sushi. I'd trade all three of our "chinese" places for one good Pakistani kabob stand.
I got nothing of value to add except hopefully a laugh, and my wish that you stay sober another day.
You're a lucky man. Wife, son, the fellowship of AA and kabobs. Man, I miss kabobs. I live in Iowa and while I like things I can't get in the UK, like direct sunshine and cheap gasoline, I sure as heck miss kabobs. Any ethnic food for that matter. Here "ethnic" is Americanized Chinese and Mexican with the occassional sushi. I'd trade all three of our "chinese" places for one good Pakistani kabob stand.
I got nothing of value to add except hopefully a laugh, and my wish that you stay sober another day.
Thanks AM, yes, today I've got a lot for the gratitude list!
There's an excellent kebab/kabob place pretty close to where I live. I love kebabs! Salad and garlic mayonnaise please! :)
Have you spent time over here? Kebabs are a very important part of culture. ;)
