I'm sure that this topic has come up more than once. I really get tired of this labeling bullsh*t at meetings. Being a "newbie" makes my opinion of less merit???? Being an "oldtimer" makes a person some kind of "higher power" (for lack of a better word)
Us "newbies" have opinions and feelings too. I've learned as much from newbies as I have from the oldtimers.
I'm tired of going to AA. Us "newbies" (as we are frequently referred to) get treated with no respect by many of the oldtimers. Sorry to "piss on the birthday cake" but more than one oldtimer has ended up back in rehab. I never thought of AA as a contest to see how long any person could stay sober- but I guess it is to this particular gang (in my town)
Call it a piss-poor attitude if you wish. I stressed my opinion last night and got berated again. Asked a simple question and got a sarcastic answer. Not the first time mind you. I'm really tired of it and it pisses me off!
I guess it's my higher power and me from now on. I'm staying away from AA. You can have it oldtimers- this cat has no desire to attend any more meetings. If I go back to my old ways it won't be by accident.
I can't honestly say that I'll never drink again even though I have no desire to do so at this time. I feel that I have come a long way in a short time and I like the way things are going with my sobriety. But I guess this doesn't mean sh*t to the oldtimers.
Had to vent- sorry if I offended anyone
Kevin
Doll said
Oct 15, 2005
I understand completely. Got a few of "those" in my homegroup too. I'm under 90 days and some of them think I should not speak unless spoken to, AT ALL. I've been berated a few times myself here and there. But, I've learned which meetings "they" prefer and I go to different ones.
Sometimes I get tired of hearing the same old bullshit from the same old timers, so I close my eyes and repeat to myself "hear the message, not the messenger". It helps.
I discussed this with my sponsor and what SHE thinks is the ONLY THING that counts to me. She believes in giving it away. She also tells me what others think of me is none of my business.
Maybe you can check out some meetings in another town close by?
Hang in there. Look for a solution. I'm sure one can be found.
Love and hugs
Doll
Badger said
Oct 15, 2005
Hi Kevin,
this is just my thoughts so hope you dont mind,yeah I to find some of the oldtimers a bit stuffy or holier than you types, but still others are real great to listen to, we are all sick people trying to get better,
hope you dont mind i took the liberty of reading your earlier posts an see your job means you dont get to many meetins an your around booze alot...just maybe that aint helping.
what about finding a different meeting, anyway hope it works itself out, hang in there
all the best Badger
Badger said
Oct 15, 2005
ooh i dint copy you honest Doll thats spooky
Badger
cooncatbob said
Oct 15, 2005
W e call'em grumpy old geezers where I'm from, like others have said try checking out other meetings, not all meetings are fill with holier then thou big book thumpers. Also you might try checking out some NA meeting (considered by some to be the redheaded stepchild of the recovery world). Alcohol is considered a drug in NA so alkies are welcome. Don't let the Bastards run you out, it's your recovery too. Good luck Bob.
Phil said
Oct 15, 2005
Hi Kev-I can understand how you feel. In this area, we get some oldtimers that think they have all the answers--and have it altogether, and can do nothing but preach, to newcommers, about what they should be doing and not doing--or putting them down, to build themselves up.
And there are some that have egos beyond reach-life is going great, as long as everythings going their way. Its the big "I am thing"
I have seen what happens to some of these people, when the shit hits the fan. Not pleasant.
At 15 years sober, I remember saying "Ive got it made"
Wrong!! 6 days later my life went for a crap, and over the next couple of thousand days, there was a lot of work to be done, and a lot of getting honest with oneself, and its been a very humbling experience.
If you were up ealier than I was this morning, then youve got more sobriety than I have today, and thats how I hafta look at it today. Just for today.
I learn more from the people comming into this program, than I do, from the ones that have been in, for a period of time.
To be honest--there are meetings that I just dont go to today, because there are too many people playing God, and I hafta stay away from them for me.
Im also in service work, and at some of these meetings, I get taught about patience and tolerence, and keeping my mouth shut--re reacting over some of it.
Cant change em. And I hafta keep a very open mind, and Let Go and Let God.
You have a good night Bud!!
cheri said
Oct 16, 2005
I call it the GOD complex..."if you listen to me and do exactly as I SAY, you'll stay sober."
The problem is I didn't know what I wanted out of sobriety and I didn't know how to get it so I had to listen to the older ones for awhile. I believe that my sponsor was God sent and I went to her with any question I had for a long time.And she didn't feed me her opinion on anything, I was in the big book looking for the answers to my questions.
I've met alot of people that have long term sobriety but that's all. Any body that berates a newcomer for having a question is talking the talk but they aren't walking the walk. I'm glad I had a choice of 28 meetings a week to choose from in the beginning...I hope you have a choice too. Find another meeting to go to if you can. It's really hard to try and do this in your own.
Love cheri
Phil said
Oct 16, 2005
um--Kevin. Ive got a son thats from Ontario, thats fairly new to AA, and going through some of this stuff. You wouldnt happen to be him, would you?
Not trying to break your anonimity--but shoot me an email, and let me know hu? or dont--up to you.
I do know one thing Bud. I cant stay sane without meetings. Take what you need, and leave the rest.
um--Kevin. Ive got a son thats from Ontario, thats fairly new to AA, and going through some of this stuff. You wouldnt happen to be him, would you? Not trying to break your anonimity--but shoot me an email, and let me know hu? or dont--up to you. I do know one thing Bud. I cant stay sane without meetings. Take what you need, and leave the rest. philipld@sympatico.ca
Sorry Phil, I live in Michigan I hope things work out for your son.
Thanks for the replies everyone At least I know I can come here
Kevin
rosie light shines said
Oct 16, 2005
hey kevin......i totally relate.....
you are JUST as precious....JUST as contributing as ANY of the *oldies--newbies....middlebees* really, i agree!!!! EVERYONE has somethign to give and something to receive.....i can't TELL you how many *newbies* and i say that with love and respect, have helped me with an issue......i don't care if your in the program one DAY!!!! your here....you are with us, and you are part of us....JUST as much as anyone else.........good for you kevin!!!! telling those others your feelings........good 4 U!!!!!! your friend in recovery/ rosie
leejosepho said
Oct 17, 2005
FraKctured wrote:
Hey all- I'm sure that this topic has come up more than once. I really get tired of this labeling bullsh*t at meetings. Being a "newbie" makes my opinion of less merit????
Not necessarily. The real question is the value of the opinion, and not who did the opining. But either way, here is the ideal for all of us - especially "oldtimers" - to keep in mind:
"Most of us sense that real tolerance of other people's shortcomings and viewpoints and a respect for their opinions are attitudes which make us more useful to others" (B.B., page 19).
FraKctured wrote:
Being an "oldtimer" makes a person some kind of "higher power" (for lack of a better word)?
No, certainly not. However, I am at least one former sufferer who came here with no clue about how to recover ... and "Recovered Dave" actually could have turned out to be "God", for all I knew!
FraKctured wrote:
Us "newbies" have opinions and feelings too.
Yes, and at least in my own case, I am still today very grateful people helped me learn to set those aside for a time ...
FraKctured wrote:
I've learned as much from newbies as I have from the oldtimers.
It is sad if the "oldtimers" you have encountered so far actually had so little to share, but at least you are learning something, eh?!
FraKctured wrote:
I never thought of AA as a contest to see how long any person could stay sober ...
No, that is something best tried *before* we get here:
"As we look back, we feel we had gone on drinking many years beyond the point where we could quit on our will power. If anyone questions whether he has entered this dangerous area, let him try leaving liquor alone for one year ..." (page 34).
FraKctured wrote:
I feel that I have come a long way in a short time and I like the way things are going with my sobriety. But I guess this doesn't mean sh*t to the oldtimers ...
Not true, my dear fellow. Rather, we have actually been right there ourselves:
“Now and then a serious drinker, being dry at the moment says, ‘I don't miss it at all. Feel better. Work better. Having a better time.’ As ex-problem drinkers, we smile at such a sally. We know our friend is like a boy whistling in the dark to keep up his spirits. He fools himself ...” (pages 151-152).
Saving a piece of cake for you ...
-- Edited by leejosepho at 09:41, 2005-10-17
-- Edited by leejosepho at 09:42, 2005-10-17
FraKctured said
Nov 5, 2005
Thanks gang- I'm happy to say that we got things straightened out at the meetings. I vented there as I did here and it was understood.
Hey all-
I'm sure that this topic has come up more than once. I really get tired of this labeling bullsh*t at meetings. Being a "newbie" makes my opinion of less merit???? Being an "oldtimer" makes a person some kind of "higher power" (for lack of a better word)
Us "newbies" have opinions and feelings too. I've learned as much from newbies as I have from the oldtimers.
I'm tired of going to AA. Us "newbies" (as we are frequently referred to) get treated with no respect by many of the oldtimers. Sorry to "piss on the birthday cake" but more than one oldtimer has ended up back in rehab. I never thought of AA as a contest to see how long any person could stay sober- but I guess it is to this particular gang (in my town)
Call it a piss-poor attitude if you wish. I stressed my opinion last night and got berated again. Asked a simple question and got a sarcastic answer. Not the first time mind you. I'm really tired of it and it pisses me off!
I guess it's my higher power and me from now on. I'm staying away from AA. You can have it oldtimers- this cat has no desire to attend any more meetings. If I go back to my old ways it won't be by accident.
I can't honestly say that I'll never drink again even though I have no desire to do so at this time. I feel that I have come a long way in a short time and I like the way things are going with my sobriety. But I guess this doesn't mean sh*t to the oldtimers.
Had to vent- sorry if I offended anyone
Kevin
I understand completely. Got a few of "those" in my homegroup too. I'm under 90 days and some of them think I should not speak unless spoken to, AT ALL. I've been berated a few times myself here and there. But, I've learned which meetings "they" prefer and I go to different ones.
Sometimes I get tired of hearing the same old bullshit from the same old timers, so I close my eyes and repeat to myself "hear the message, not the messenger". It helps.
I discussed this with my sponsor and what SHE thinks is the ONLY THING that counts to me. She believes in giving it away. She also tells me what others think of me is none of my business.
Maybe you can check out some meetings in another town close by?
Hang in there. Look for a solution. I'm sure one can be found.
Love and hugs
Doll
Hi Kevin,
this is just my thoughts so hope you dont mind,yeah I to find some of the oldtimers a bit stuffy or holier than you types, but still others are real great to listen to, we are all sick people trying to get better,
hope you dont mind i took the liberty of reading your earlier posts an see your job means you dont get to many meetins an your around booze alot...just maybe that aint helping.
what about finding a different meeting, anyway hope it works itself out, hang in there
all the best Badger
ooh i dint copy you honest Doll thats spooky
Badger
Hi Kev-I can understand how you feel. In this area, we get some oldtimers that think they have all the answers--and have it altogether, and can do nothing but preach, to newcommers, about what they should be doing and not doing--or putting them down, to build themselves up.
And there are some that have egos beyond reach-life is going great, as long as everythings going their way. Its the big "I am thing"
I have seen what happens to some of these people, when the shit hits the fan. Not pleasant.
At 15 years sober, I remember saying "Ive got it made"
Wrong!! 6 days later my life went for a crap, and over the next couple of thousand days, there was a lot of work to be done, and a lot of getting honest with oneself, and its been a very humbling experience.
If you were up ealier than I was this morning, then youve got more sobriety than I have today, and thats how I hafta look at it today. Just for today.
I learn more from the people comming into this program, than I do, from the ones that have been in, for a period of time.
To be honest--there are meetings that I just dont go to today, because there are too many people playing God, and I hafta stay away from them for me.
Im also in service work, and at some of these meetings, I get taught about patience and tolerence, and keeping my mouth shut--re reacting over some of it.
Cant change em. And I hafta keep a very open mind, and Let Go and Let God.
You have a good night Bud!!
I call it the GOD complex..."if you listen to me and do exactly as I SAY, you'll stay sober."
The problem is I didn't know what I wanted out of sobriety and I didn't know how to get it so I had to listen to the older ones for awhile. I believe that my sponsor was God sent and I went to her with any question I had for a long time.And she didn't feed me her opinion on anything, I was in the big book looking for the answers to my questions.
I've met alot of people that have long term sobriety but that's all. Any body that berates a newcomer for having a question is talking the talk but they aren't walking the walk. I'm glad I had a choice of 28 meetings a week to choose from in the beginning...I hope you have a choice too. Find another meeting to go to if you can. It's really hard to try and do this in your own.
Love cheri
um--Kevin. Ive got a son thats from Ontario, thats fairly new to AA, and going through some of this stuff. You wouldnt happen to be him, would you?
Not trying to break your anonimity--but shoot me an email, and let me know hu? or dont--up to you.
I do know one thing Bud. I cant stay sane without meetings. Take what you need, and leave the rest.
philipld@sympatico.ca
hey kevin......i totally relate.....
you are JUST as precious....JUST as contributing as ANY of the *oldies--newbies....middlebees* really, i agree!!!! EVERYONE has somethign to give and something to receive.....i can't TELL you how many *newbies* and i say that with love and respect, have helped me with an issue......i don't care if your in the program one DAY!!!! your here....you are with us, and you are part of us....JUST as much as anyone else.........good for you kevin!!!! telling those others your feelings........good 4 U!!!!!! your friend in recovery/ rosie
-- Edited by leejosepho at 09:41, 2005-10-17
-- Edited by leejosepho at 09:42, 2005-10-17
Thanks gang- I'm happy to say that we got things straightened out at the meetings. I vented there as I did here and it was understood.
-- Edited by FraKctured at 01:12, 2005-11-05