Hey guys, I'm in a really big hurry today, busy, busy, busy.My son came yesterday and we moved a lot to storage, mostly books. I am putting a few in the garage sale, oh, I don't know ;maybe not.
Anyway, last night at birthday night, a guy who got his 7 year chip was talking about sticking with the winners.
I would like to know ya'lls definition of a winner in the program of A.A.What's the definition of a loser, and is there ever a time when you tell a loser not to come back to the program.
This should be interesting.I hope anyway.By the way I think everyone here is a winner, and I do mean everyone.
(((Hugs)))
GammyRose
Phil said
Aug 31, 2005
Hi Gammy. Always good to hear from you, my freind.
My opinion only. There are no losers in AA.
There are those tho, that I hafta avoid, and not react to, and live and let live.
The ones, that very subtely can talk the talk, but cannot walk the walk. They can fix everyone else but themselves.
Then there are the ego maniacs, playing God, and think that they are above everyone else.
Then there are the ones that can put on a pretty good show at an AA meeting--but then walk out the door, and kick the cat all over the place.
There are others that have done nothing more, than put the plug in the jug.
Well-I used to be that way.
The people Im attracted to in AA are the ones with peace and serenity in their lives--are working the program in their daily lives--the ones that will listen to me vent and not judge me, but lovingly suggest, and share their experience strength and hope. The ones with a smile on their faces, that you know is real. The ones that are in trying situations in their lives, and still hold it all together, in a calm, positive manner.
The ones that reach out to newcommers, as a caring, recovering person, and give them hope, asking nothing in return.
The ones that will go out of their way 24/7 to be there for someone else, and give fully to others, right from their hearts.
Those are the winners-the real honest, down to Earth winners.
The ones that can say "Hey! You want what we have? We can offer you the tools to get that.
And then show them how--not tell them how. My thoughts.
Take care of Gammy Hu? Hugs
Doll said
Aug 31, 2005
Hey Gammy. Good luck w/the garage sale. Letting go of my "stuff" well, that's a tough one for me too.
Let's see, winners to me are the ones who have quality sobriety. The one's who walk the walk as was said and don't have to talk the talk. It just shines through in everything they say and do.
I'd say no one is a loser if they've come to AA for help. However, there are some in my home group who are there for a free ride. Example : They want someone to drive them around. One just the other day called the Club house and wanted to know if someone would come pick her up and take her to the movies and then pick her up afterwards. Now, I don't have a problem with picking someone up for a meeting or taking them home, but the movies! Then there are those who can quote the BB chapter and verse and can't make it past 30 or 60 or 90 days but want to tell everyone else what they should be doing or what they're doing wrong. Then there's the ones who want to add a 13th Step to recovery. EwWw!! I've encountered 2 or 3 of these myself.
I would never tell someone not to come back, no matter what. I just distance myself from them the best I can and I have found that I am better off if I don't socialize with some of the AA's in my home group outside the meetings.......Not everyone has my (your) best interest at heart.
Love to you
Doll
Awesome topic, btw.
-- Edited by Doll at 23:06, 2005-08-31
cheri said
Sep 1, 2005
Hey Gammy...
Love the topic. Thanks for posting it. Hmmm...winners in AA. People who are working the program, no matter what is going on in thier lives. People who can pick up the phone or give a hug after the meeting, asking everyone there if things are going ok, when thier whole life is going to hell, but they stop and ask how they can be of service to others. People who come early to make coffee, stay late to clean up, offer to take a newcomer to coffee and end up buying them a huge chocolate chip cookie sundae to help them stop the cravings. Those that give unconditional love to all who walk into the rooms....hugging the newcomer, the oldtimer and the person who just came back after doing a bit more research on the subject. You, Phil, Ellen, Nic, Wendy, Doll, Rick, Chris, all the others I know I've missed. This program and this board works because of people like you. Stick with the people who have what you want.
I go along with Doll on the losers part...they are looking for something but haven't found it yet. It's not for us to decide when they'll get it, and so we can't tell them to not come back. We can, however, establish some boundaries for our group. We can ask the person disrupting the meeting to refrain from cross-talk. We can ask the wet alkie to refrain from sharing if drunk at a meeting. We can(and this should be the same sex person doing it) remind the 13-stepper that AA is not a dating service. We can tell the person expecting AA members to run them around or clean thier house or buy thier groceries or watch thier kids that AA is to achieve sobriety, not a social services agency.
What I've found is that the ones that really get under my skin...usually are doing something that I either used to do, and it bothers me, or that I secretly wish I could do and get away with. And, as my sponsor always says, there's a step for that!!
Love you much, cheri
ps...I'd keep the books too!
-- Edited by cheri at 05:01, 2005-09-01
Rick said
Sep 1, 2005
ALL i CAN ADD IS THE WINNER ISN'T THE GUY THAT I MET AT A MEETING WHO ASK FOR A RIDE HOME AND THEN WANTS ME TO COME OVER AND FIX HIS MOTORCYCLE.
MY BUDDY SPONSORS A GUY WHO NEEDS HIS TRACTOR FIXED, LAWN MOWER FIXED RIDE TO PICK UP HIS LAWN MOWER, HOUSE PAINTED ETC, AND ON AND ON. OH HE IS SOBER 20 YEARS AND NEEDS A HANDY MAN NOT A SPONSOR
THE WINNER ISN'T THIS GAL WHO BRINGS UP TOPICS ON A REGULAR BASIS AND STAYS FOR 20 MIN TO 30 MIN OF THE MEETING. OF COURSE SHE WONDERS WHY SHE CAN'T STAY SOBER AT ALL.
WALK THE WALK??? i TRY BUT i JUST CAME BACK FROM RESEARCH. MY LAST PERIOD OF SOBERITY WAS 15 MONTHS. THE ONE BEFORE 6 YEARS. WHERE DO I FIT? i GUESS U JUST KEEP ON LEARNING ONE DAY AT A TIME. iN MY BOOK WINNERS ARE IN THE ACTION NOT THE YEARS. AS SAID, I'M LOOKING TO BE REASONABLY HAPPY ON A DAILY BASIS AND HAVE TO LOOK FOR THAT TYPE OF PERSON FOR HELP. IF DRY, MEAN AND MISERABLE I MIGHT AS WELL DRINK. THE WINNERS HAVE A REAL LIFE. THERE ARE NO LOSERS IF YOUR SOBER TODAY. YOUR A WINNER FOR THE DAY AT LEAST TO SOME EXTENT. JUST THE OPIONION OF THIS DRUNK
PS YOU ONLY THROW A LOSER OUT WHEN HE OR SHE IS DISRUPTING THE WHOLE MEETING.
WE ESCORTED A GUY OUT WHO SAID HE HAD NO ALCOHOL PROBLEM AND CAME TO THE MEETING WITH A GOLF CLUB AND WAS READY TO USE IT!! HE WAS ASKED TO LEAVE ON ANOTHER DAY WHEN HE STARTED ON NON AA STUFF AND WOULDN'T STOP.
-- Edited by Rick at 07:49, 2005-09-01
-- Edited by Rick at 07:58, 2005-09-01
GammyRose said
Sep 1, 2005
Thanks guys for the great shares. I knew I could get some, honest, heartfelt opinions from ya'll.
I left the meeting the other night with mixed emotions,trying real hard not to judge others, but feeling uncomfortable. The man who was talking about winners is the one who is constantly putting down people who don't seem to be able to work the program, he's the one who's wife has shared that he is not so nice at home, he comes to a meeting maybe every 3 months, he is talking the talk, but I'm wondering if he's walking the walk.
There again, who am I to judge.Our group has a lot of people who like to go out and experiment.When they walk back through the door, I have always been there to give them a hug, tell them welcome back,and to listen and share my experience, strength and hope with them. I was told my responsibilty was to carry the message of A.A. , not the alcoholic,and that's what I try to do to the best of my ability.
Now, we put my husband in the mix,and that's where I get all tangled up. He's been in the program for 18 years and can't seem to get it. A few guys have said he should just quit coming to meetings, he's hopeless,he makes the group look bad.Hmmmmm,I get a little upset, and then I start judging these people who are saying these things. That's when I have to step back, say the Serenity Prayer, over and over again.Ask God to hold me back, cause I want to jump in the big middle of them. Yes you can take the bartender out of the bar, but you can't take the bartender out of the woman, and I used some physical strength to handle a few situations in the ooooold days.I know, not a good way to handle things today, that may be why my body is in the shape it's in today...
Anyway, I just want to do God's will , I want to always remember that my purpose for being in A.A. is to reach out to those who still suffer, to make sure I'm always there, as already said ,to make coffee, greet the newcomer and the old man finding his way back, to love them until they can love themselves.I must work the steps everyday in my life, that I might be able to help others.I will not give up five minutes before the miracle.
Thanks again for your wisdom, your shares are very important to me, I know I will always get honest, straight talk from you guys, even Phil, after he picks himself up after falling off the turnip truck.I need to hear other opinions, because I tend to be either to soft,or to hard, never seem to get the balance thing just right .
I thank God for each one of you everyday. Hey, we are all in the same boat, if we have stayed sober today, that's a great thing, and if we haven't we can start our day over at any moment and before we know it we have 24 hours, that's all that matters, to me anyway.I'm trying to keep it simple.
(((Hugs)))
GammyRose
Phil said
Sep 1, 2005
Turnip trucks Gammy? God!! I see any more of them, I think it will be easier, just to go jump in a lake somewhere, with rocks tied to both feet.
Cant handle any more of them. I know that much.
Just wanna enjoy living for a change, in slow happy mode.
You and your husband are in my thoughts each day. We love you, and we care.
PEANUT said
Sep 1, 2005
I don't believe people are winners or losers. This is my own mere opinion though. Hi I am Peanut, and I'm an alchoholic/addict. I'm new to this forum, but will be using it quite a bit to vent as I have a busy busy life. I never understood why, as I have met people in recovery that have also said stick with the winners, rather than the losers. I suppose they are refering to those who are living in the solution.
I do not look at anyone as being a loser, because we are all here for some sort of purpose. It just takes time for some to find out what that purpose is... I'll use me for example. When I was using, and the following days after using I felt like a huge loser. But when I look back now, and this time it is a serious look. I wasn't a loser, just I had no clue how to deal with life and real emotion. And everyone is different, some it takes longer or shorter than others to get, and even then some never do get it or realize why they are here.
Anyhow I am rambling. Allot of people stereotype I used to do allot of that myself, and now I always see a little bit of me in that "winner" or "loser"...I just had my 2 month birthday yesterday once again but this time I'm diving in whole instead of getting just my toes wet.
LOVE U ALL!
Peanut
nancyjo59 said
Sep 2, 2005
Gammy Rose,
Great question to throw out there. Praying for you and your husband. Good luck at your garage sale( my favorite past time), but sure would not want to have to put one together . Good Luck!
Being that I didnt really associate with those at face to face meeting, it was nice to read the input of those who had.
My last meeting years ago was a bad experience. I was having a real bad day. I said at the meeting I wish I were wealthy. I wished that I could afford the Betty Ford Clinic and get some help( I have never been to a hospital setting for my alcholism). All of a sudden the man next to me stood up, pushed his chair back ( loudly) and said " Dont We All", and stormed out of the meeting. I was mortified!! Didnt know what to say. Not one word was said about it!! Almost burst into tears. Felt like some sorta of an idiot. Was I justified feeling that way?
On the other hand I could sence the sincerity in others. One could see it in their eyes and actions. They made you feel welcome. But the bad seemed to outweigh the good at the meeting. Ultimately I gave up on the program....which unfortunatelly was a big mistake.
Thanks to all of you here....I owe a lot of my soberity for the things I read hear. I try to take what really strikes me and apply it to my life...which has really helped
Take Care
Nancy JO
nancyjo59 said
Sep 2, 2005
Welcome Peanut
You are about to embark on a wonderfull experience here.
Hey guys, I'm in a really big hurry today, busy, busy, busy.My son came yesterday and we moved a lot to storage, mostly books. I am putting a few in the garage sale, oh, I don't know ;maybe not.
Anyway, last night at birthday night, a guy who got his 7 year chip was talking about sticking with the winners.
I would like to know ya'lls definition of a winner in the program of A.A.What's the definition of a loser, and is there ever a time when you tell a loser not to come back to the program.
This should be interesting.I hope anyway.By the way I think everyone here is a winner, and I do mean everyone.
(((Hugs)))
GammyRose
Hi Gammy. Always good to hear from you, my freind.
My opinion only. There are no losers in AA.
There are those tho, that I hafta avoid, and not react to, and live and let live.
The ones, that very subtely can talk the talk, but cannot walk the walk. They can fix everyone else but themselves.
Then there are the ego maniacs, playing God, and think that they are above everyone else.
Then there are the ones that can put on a pretty good show at an AA meeting--but then walk out the door, and kick the cat all over the place.
There are others that have done nothing more, than put the plug in the jug.
Well-I used to be that way.
The people Im attracted to in AA are the ones with peace and serenity in their lives--are working the program in their daily lives--the ones that will listen to me vent and not judge me, but lovingly suggest, and share their experience strength and hope. The ones with a smile on their faces, that you know is real. The ones that are in trying situations in their lives, and still hold it all together, in a calm, positive manner.
The ones that reach out to newcommers, as a caring, recovering person, and give them hope, asking nothing in return.
The ones that will go out of their way 24/7 to be there for someone else, and give fully to others, right from their hearts.
Those are the winners-the real honest, down to Earth winners.
The ones that can say "Hey! You want what we have? We can offer you the tools to get that.
And then show them how--not tell them how. My thoughts.
Take care of Gammy Hu? Hugs
Hey Gammy. Good luck w/the garage sale. Letting go of my "stuff" well, that's a tough one for me too.
Let's see, winners to me are the ones who have quality sobriety. The one's who walk the walk as was said and don't have to talk the talk. It just shines through in everything they say and do.
I'd say no one is a loser if they've come to AA for help. However, there are some in my home group who are there for a free ride. Example : They want someone to drive them around. One just the other day called the Club house and wanted to know if someone would come pick her up and take her to the movies and then pick her up afterwards. Now, I don't have a problem with picking someone up for a meeting or taking them home, but the movies! Then there are those who can quote the BB chapter and verse and can't make it past 30 or 60 or 90 days but want to tell everyone else what they should be doing or what they're doing wrong. Then there's the ones who want to add a 13th Step to recovery. EwWw!! I've encountered 2 or 3 of these myself.
I would never tell someone not to come back, no matter what. I just distance myself from them the best I can and I have found that I am better off if I don't socialize with some of the AA's in my home group outside the meetings.......Not everyone has my (your) best interest at heart.
Love to you
Doll
Awesome topic, btw.
-- Edited by Doll at 23:06, 2005-08-31
Hey Gammy...
Love the topic. Thanks for posting it. Hmmm...winners in AA. People who are working the program, no matter what is going on in thier lives. People who can pick up the phone or give a hug after the meeting, asking everyone there if things are going ok, when thier whole life is going to hell, but they stop and ask how they can be of service to others. People who come early to make coffee, stay late to clean up, offer to take a newcomer to coffee and end up buying them a huge chocolate chip cookie sundae to help them stop the cravings. Those that give unconditional love to all who walk into the rooms....hugging the newcomer, the oldtimer and the person who just came back after doing a bit more research on the subject. You, Phil, Ellen, Nic, Wendy, Doll, Rick, Chris, all the others I know I've missed. This program and this board works because of people like you. Stick with the people who have what you want.
I go along with Doll on the losers part...they are looking for something but haven't found it yet. It's not for us to decide when they'll get it, and so we can't tell them to not come back. We can, however, establish some boundaries for our group. We can ask the person disrupting the meeting to refrain from cross-talk. We can ask the wet alkie to refrain from sharing if drunk at a meeting. We can(and this should be the same sex person doing it) remind the 13-stepper that AA is not a dating service. We can tell the person expecting AA members to run them around or clean thier house or buy thier groceries or watch thier kids that AA is to achieve sobriety, not a social services agency.
What I've found is that the ones that really get under my skin...usually are doing something that I either used to do, and it bothers me, or that I secretly wish I could do and get away with. And, as my sponsor always says, there's a step for that!!
Love you much, cheri
ps...I'd keep the books too!
-- Edited by cheri at 05:01, 2005-09-01
ALL i CAN ADD IS THE WINNER ISN'T THE GUY THAT I MET AT A MEETING WHO ASK FOR A RIDE HOME AND THEN WANTS ME TO COME OVER AND FIX HIS MOTORCYCLE.
MY BUDDY SPONSORS A GUY WHO NEEDS HIS TRACTOR FIXED, LAWN MOWER FIXED RIDE TO PICK UP HIS LAWN MOWER, HOUSE PAINTED ETC, AND ON AND ON. OH HE IS SOBER 20 YEARS AND NEEDS A HANDY MAN NOT A SPONSOR
THE WINNER ISN'T THIS GAL WHO BRINGS UP TOPICS ON A REGULAR BASIS AND STAYS FOR 20 MIN TO 30 MIN OF THE MEETING. OF COURSE SHE WONDERS WHY SHE CAN'T STAY SOBER AT ALL.
WALK THE WALK??? i TRY BUT i JUST CAME BACK FROM RESEARCH. MY LAST PERIOD OF SOBERITY WAS 15 MONTHS. THE ONE BEFORE 6 YEARS. WHERE DO I FIT? i GUESS U JUST KEEP ON LEARNING ONE DAY AT A TIME. iN MY BOOK WINNERS ARE IN THE ACTION NOT THE YEARS. AS SAID, I'M LOOKING TO BE REASONABLY HAPPY ON A DAILY BASIS AND HAVE TO LOOK FOR THAT TYPE OF PERSON FOR HELP. IF DRY, MEAN AND MISERABLE I MIGHT AS WELL DRINK. THE WINNERS HAVE A REAL LIFE. THERE ARE NO LOSERS IF YOUR SOBER TODAY. YOUR A WINNER FOR THE DAY AT LEAST TO SOME EXTENT. JUST THE OPIONION OF THIS DRUNK
PS YOU ONLY THROW A LOSER OUT WHEN HE OR SHE IS DISRUPTING THE WHOLE MEETING.
WE ESCORTED A GUY OUT WHO SAID HE HAD NO ALCOHOL PROBLEM AND CAME TO THE MEETING WITH A GOLF CLUB AND WAS READY TO USE IT!! HE WAS ASKED TO LEAVE ON ANOTHER DAY WHEN HE STARTED ON NON AA STUFF AND WOULDN'T STOP.
-- Edited by Rick at 07:49, 2005-09-01
-- Edited by Rick at 07:58, 2005-09-01
Thanks guys for the great shares. I knew I could get some, honest, heartfelt opinions from ya'll.
I left the meeting the other night with mixed emotions,trying real hard not to judge others, but feeling uncomfortable. The man who was talking about winners is the one who is constantly putting down people who don't seem to be able to work the program, he's the one who's wife has shared that he is not so nice at home, he comes to a meeting maybe every 3 months, he is talking the talk, but I'm wondering if he's walking the walk.
There again, who am I to judge.Our group has a lot of people who like to go out and experiment.When they walk back through the door, I have always been there to give them a hug, tell them welcome back,and to listen and share my experience, strength and hope with them. I was told my responsibilty was to carry the message of A.A. , not the alcoholic,and that's what I try to do to the best of my ability.
Now, we put my husband in the mix,and that's where I get all tangled up. He's been in the program for 18 years and can't seem to get it. A few guys have said he should just quit coming to meetings, he's hopeless,he makes the group look bad.Hmmmmm,I get a little upset, and then I start judging these people who are saying these things. That's when I have to step back, say the Serenity Prayer, over and over again.Ask God to hold me back, cause I want to jump in the big middle of them. Yes you can take the bartender out of the bar, but you can't take the bartender out of the woman, and I used some physical strength to handle a few situations in the ooooold days.I know, not a good way to handle things today, that may be why my body is in the shape it's in today...
Anyway, I just want to do God's will , I want to always remember that my purpose for being in A.A. is to reach out to those who still suffer, to make sure I'm always there, as already said ,to make coffee, greet the newcomer and the old man finding his way back, to love them until they can love themselves.I must work the steps everyday in my life, that I might be able to help others.I will not give up five minutes before the miracle.
Thanks again for your wisdom, your shares are very important to me, I know I will always get honest, straight talk from you guys, even Phil, after he picks himself up after falling off the turnip truck.I need to hear other opinions, because I tend to be either to soft,or to hard, never seem to get the balance thing just right .
I thank God for each one of you everyday. Hey, we are all in the same boat, if we have stayed sober today, that's a great thing, and if we haven't we can start our day over at any moment and before we know it we have 24 hours, that's all that matters, to me anyway.I'm trying to keep it simple.
(((Hugs)))
GammyRose
Turnip trucks Gammy? God!! I see any more of them, I think it will be easier, just to go jump in a lake somewhere, with rocks tied to both feet.
Cant handle any more of them. I know that much.
Just wanna enjoy living for a change, in slow happy mode.
You and your husband are in my thoughts each day. We love you, and we care.
I don't believe people are winners or losers. This is my own mere opinion though. Hi I am Peanut, and I'm an alchoholic/addict. I'm new to this forum, but will be using it quite a bit to vent as I have a busy busy life. I never understood why, as I have met people in recovery that have also said stick with the winners, rather than the losers. I suppose they are refering to those who are living in the solution.
I do not look at anyone as being a loser, because we are all here for some sort of purpose. It just takes time for some to find out what that purpose is... I'll use me for example. When I was using, and the following days after using I felt like a huge loser. But when I look back now, and this time it is a serious look. I wasn't a loser, just I had no clue how to deal with life and real emotion. And everyone is different, some it takes longer or shorter than others to get, and even then some never do get it or realize why they are here.
Anyhow I am rambling. Allot of people stereotype I used to do allot of that myself, and now I always see a little bit of me in that "winner" or "loser"...I just had my 2 month birthday yesterday once again but this time I'm diving in whole instead of getting just my toes wet.
LOVE U ALL!
Peanut
Gammy Rose,
Great question to throw out there. Praying for you and your husband.
Good luck at your garage sale( my favorite past time), but sure would not want to have to put one together . Good Luck!
Being that I didnt really associate with those at face to face meeting, it was nice to read the input of those who had.
My last meeting years ago was a bad experience. I was having a real bad day. I said at the meeting I wish I were wealthy. I wished that I could afford the Betty Ford Clinic and get some help( I have never been to a hospital setting for my alcholism). All of a sudden the man next to me stood up, pushed his chair back ( loudly) and said " Dont We All", and stormed out of the meeting. I was mortified!! Didnt know what to say. Not one word was said about it!! Almost burst into tears. Felt like some sorta of an idiot. Was I justified feeling that way?
On the other hand I could sence the sincerity in others. One could see it in their eyes and actions. They made you feel welcome. But the bad seemed to outweigh the good at the meeting. Ultimately I gave up on the program....which unfortunatelly was a big mistake.
Thanks to all of you here....I owe a lot of my soberity for the things I read hear. I try to take what really strikes me and apply it to my life...which has really helped
Take Care
Nancy JO
Welcome Peanut
You are about to embark on a wonderfull experience here.
Nancy Jo