The Beauty of AA is when we reach the 12th step we learn to Share Experience, Strength, and Hope, our failures and Successes become our most valuable commodity
Will Rogers wrote:
Good judgment comes from experience, and most of that comes from bad judgment
When I sit down with My Sponsor, or a valued friend in AA and tell them what is going on in my life what usually follows is they follow this pattern, "When I was in your shoes, I tried this, this and this, and got this result (usually painful failures) but then I tried this and got this result (a different result, usually one more amenable and equating to "success")
They share their experience (what happened) strength (how and what they changed and how they had help and support, just as you do) and hope (if you change your actions you can get different results as well) or in other words "What it was like, what happened, and what it's like now"
We learn to not share beyond our experience, because that is how many of us are raised -Do as I say not as I do- a statement that leads nowhere fast, and how we behaved while we were drinking, our actions didn't match our words, which leads to an emotional disconnect, and is the exact opposite of integrity, which is when one's words match their actions
Like Gonee posted awhile back, if someone has only made it as far as the second step, that as far as they can take you.
If someone has never had a successful long term relationship in sobriety, all they have to offer is how NOT to do it.
If someone has no experience in sponsoring others, they don't know how to sponsor others, all they have is an opinion about sponsorship
That was POUNDED into me to not tell people how to do things I was unable to do myself, that is what seperates AA from the rest of the world and the "professional community" where we have therapists telling us what we SHOULD do when they are unable to have successful relationships themselves, or addiction counselors with no actual experience with addiction or unable to get sober themselves
This is the key that Bill discovered talking to Bob, this was the missing link, this is why AA works, he'd been trying everything, grabbing wet drunks, being evangelical, nothing worked, and then Dr Silkworth suggested he dwell on on the hopeless feature of Alcoholism and tell them what he did to beat it.
He tried that with Dr Bob and AA was born, not "this is what you should do" but "this is what I did" when Dr Bob walked out of the room he said to his wife Anne "This is the first fellow I've ever met that drank like I did, he knows all about the drinking game"
When I had been around the Program for ten or so years I began dating a young lady and I was encountering some difficulties, and I was sharing with a group of men my frustration, these men all had long term sobriety and solid relationships, and they were silent, and all of the sudden this kid going through his "terroble twos" (the phase where we know everything about everything and aren't afraid to tell everyone what's best for them, I went through it, it was AWFUL) starts in giving me ADVICE and OPINION about dating in women in The Program (she had 13 years at the time I think, she's coming up on 25 so that's about right)
I burst into laughter, and asked "How old are you kid?"
"18" he responded defiantly
I wasn't very polite (No gasps the crowd) as a matter of fact I may have been a bit rough on the kid
I mentioned he might try being in a relationship first before he started shooting his mouth off, or at least lose his virginity, and I mentioned I had been chasing girls around AA when he was still in 3rd grade sniffing model airplane cement and stealing his daddies Playboys, I mean I lost my virginity two years before you were BORN for crying out loud!!!!
We were ROLLING...poor kid turned bright red but did hold his ground, I'll give him that, he knew what was best for everyone else, although he couldn't get it together himself....
About 5 years later he approached me and asked if I remembered way back then, smiling I said "Of Course" (We had become pretty good friends, I was still with this woman etc)
He said "I need to make amends"
...OK.......Why?
He said, turning bright red
"Because I was still a virgin, I had never even kissed a girl, and there I was shooting my mouth off telling you who was 15 years older then me how to behave in a relationship"
We hugged but I always remembered that lesson, If I share beyond my experience it's for sure going to come back to bite me in the ass, whether by arguing about my non-existant experience with those around me, having to come back and make amends later, or by keeping me up at night cringing about what I said and trying to justify it to myself.
I have done all of these things, it's just a funnier story about the virgin then me LOL and truthfully when I used to share beyond my experience, or "talk out of my a$$" my Grandsponsor would come over and literally grab me by my ear and take me outside and give me a buttchew they could hear 3 counties away, I STILL look around if I catch myself talking out of my butt and he's been dead 15 years
ESH
It works
-- Edited by LinBaba on Saturday 30th of October 2010 12:43:19 AM
attilio said
Oct 30, 2010
i still beleive in edifying.say things the way they are and if i dont have the answer i refer to the books or listen to people who walk the talk.keeps me humble and teacheable.and what you wrote makes much sense to me ,,,,,,,,,,,,thanks for another great post,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Attilio
angelov8 said
Oct 31, 2010
I related the terrible two's story to a sister in the fellowship today and she cracked up. Thanks for sharing.
-- Edited by angelov8 on Sunday 31st of October 2010 02:50:04 AM
LinBaba said
Oct 31, 2010
angelov8 wrote:
I related the terrible two's story to a sister in the fellowship today and she cracked up. Thanks for sharing.
-- Edited by angelov8 on Sunday 31st of October 2010 02:50:04 AM
Oh God it was awful, I ran around like Chicken Little, I had been to a few Joe and Charlie Big Book seminars, and I knew everything about everything, and was like "you're alllll doing it wrooonnnggg"
It's pretty common and actually a pretty good sign (if it passes) but the emotional meltdown that occurs in years 5 and 7 and then "The Desert years" (the early teens) usually deals with that pretty effectively
Now I watch others go through that phase and it's like...ooof, OK, here comes Patience, Love and Tolerance and have to remember I was awful at that time as well, and how unhappy I was
I call it "The Good Actor Blues"
The first requirement is that we be convinced that any life run on self-will can hardly be a success. On that basis we are almost always in collision with something or somebody, even though our motives are good. Most people try to live by self-propul sion. Each person is like an actor who wants to run the whole show; is forever trying to arrange the lights, the ballet, the scenery and the rest of the players in his own way. If his arrangements would only stay put, if only people would do as he wish ed, the show would be great. Everybody, including himself, would be pleased. Life would be wonderful. In trying to make these arrangements our actor may sometimes be quite virtuous. He may be kind, considerate, patient, generous; even modest and self-s acrificing. On the other hand, he may be mean, egotistical, selfish and dishonest. But, as with most humans, he is more likely to have varied traits.
What usually happens? The show doesn't come off very well. He begins to think life doesn't treat him right. He decides to exert himself more. He becomes, on the next occasion, still more demanding or gracious, as the case may be. Still the play does not suit him. Admitting he may be somewhat at fault, he is sure that other people are more to blame. He becomes angry, indignant, self-pitying. What is his basic trouble? Is he not really a self-seeker even when trying to be kind? Is he not a victim of the delusion that he can wrest satisfaction and happiness out of this world if he only manages well? Is it not evident to all the rest of the players that these are the things he wants? And do not his actions make each of them wish to retaliate, snatchin g all they can get out of the show? Is he not, even in his best moments, a producer of confusion rather than harmony?
Our actor is self-centered, ego-centric, as people like to call it nowadays.
Abamenko said
November 9th
Hola, llevaba meses intentando ahorrar para comprar un nuevo portátil, pero siempre aparecía algún gasto inesperado. Un amigo me habló de spinogambino, donde los jugadores de Español reciben bonos especiales, y decidí probar suerte. Al principio perdí varias veces, pero luego aumenté la apuesta en la ruleta y gané una cantidad impresionante. Fue una sensación increíble ver cómo todo cambiaba tan rápido. Lo recomiendo totalmente, pero siempre con responsabilidad.
AlexSeen said
November 15th
Als Gelegenheitsspieler in der Schweiz habe ich win airline ausprobiert. Die Plattform ist modern, übersichtlich und bietet viele Slots sowie klassische Casinospiele. Besonders gut gefallen mir die fairen Bonusaktionen und die schnelle Abwicklung der Zahlungen. Auch der Support ist freundlich und hilfsbereit. Ich spiele hier regelmäßig, weil alles transparent und stabil funktioniert und die mobile Version hervorragend läuft.
Will Rogers wrote:
Good judgment comes from experience, and most of that comes from bad judgment
When I sit down with My Sponsor, or a valued friend in AA and tell them what is going on in my life what usually follows is they follow this pattern, "When I was in your shoes, I tried this, this and this, and got this result (usually painful failures) but then I tried this and got this result (a different result, usually one more amenable and equating to "success")
They share their experience (what happened) strength (how and what they changed and how they had help and support, just as you do) and hope (if you change your actions you can get different results as well) or in other words "What it was like, what happened, and what it's like now"
We learn to not share beyond our experience, because that is how many of us are raised -Do as I say not as I do- a statement that leads nowhere fast, and how we behaved while we were drinking, our actions didn't match our words, which leads to an emotional disconnect, and is the exact opposite of integrity, which is when one's words match their actions
Like Gonee posted awhile back, if someone has only made it as far as the second step, that as far as they can take you.
If someone has never had a successful long term relationship in sobriety, all they have to offer is how NOT to do it.
If someone has no experience in sponsoring others, they don't know how to sponsor others, all they have is an opinion about sponsorship
That was POUNDED into me to not tell people how to do things I was unable to do myself, that is what seperates AA from the rest of the world and the "professional community" where we have therapists telling us what we SHOULD do when they are unable to have successful relationships themselves, or addiction counselors with no actual experience with addiction or unable to get sober themselves
This is the key that Bill discovered talking to Bob, this was the missing link, this is why AA works, he'd been trying everything, grabbing wet drunks, being evangelical, nothing worked, and then Dr Silkworth suggested he dwell on on the hopeless feature of Alcoholism and tell them what he did to beat it.
He tried that with Dr Bob and AA was born, not "this is what you should do" but "this is what I did" when Dr Bob walked out of the room he said to his wife Anne "This is the first fellow I've ever met that drank like I did, he knows all about the drinking game"
When I had been around the Program for ten or so years I began dating a young lady and I was encountering some difficulties, and I was sharing with a group of men my frustration, these men all had long term sobriety and solid relationships, and they were silent, and all of the sudden this kid going through his "terroble twos" (the phase where we know everything about everything and aren't afraid to tell everyone what's best for them, I went through it, it was AWFUL) starts in giving me ADVICE and OPINION about dating in women in The Program (she had 13 years at the time I think, she's coming up on 25 so that's about right)
I burst into laughter, and asked "How old are you kid?"
"18" he responded defiantly
I wasn't very polite (No gasps the crowd) as a matter of fact I may have been a bit rough on the kid
I mentioned he might try being in a relationship first before he started shooting his mouth off, or at least lose his virginity, and I mentioned I had been chasing girls around AA when he was still in 3rd grade sniffing model airplane cement and stealing his daddies Playboys, I mean I lost my virginity two years before you were BORN for crying out loud!!!!
We were ROLLING...poor kid turned bright red but did hold his ground, I'll give him that, he knew what was best for everyone else, although he couldn't get it together himself....
About 5 years later he approached me and asked if I remembered way back then, smiling I said "Of Course" (We had become pretty good friends, I was still with this woman etc)
He said "I need to make amends"
...OK.......Why?
He said, turning bright red
"Because I was still a virgin, I had never even kissed a girl, and there I was shooting my mouth off telling you who was 15 years older then me how to behave in a relationship"
We hugged but I always remembered that lesson, If I share beyond my experience it's for sure going to come back to bite me in the ass, whether by arguing about my non-existant experience with those around me, having to come back and make amends later, or by keeping me up at night cringing about what I said and trying to justify it to myself.
I have done all of these things, it's just a funnier story about the virgin then me LOL and truthfully when I used to share beyond my experience, or "talk out of my a$$" my Grandsponsor would come over and literally grab me by my ear and take me outside and give me a buttchew they could hear 3 counties away, I STILL look around if I catch myself talking out of my butt and he's been dead 15 years
ESH
It works
-- Edited by LinBaba on Saturday 30th of October 2010 12:43:19 AM
-- Edited by angelov8 on Sunday 31st of October 2010 02:50:04 AM
Hola, llevaba meses intentando ahorrar para comprar un nuevo portátil, pero siempre aparecía algún gasto inesperado. Un amigo me habló de spinogambino, donde los jugadores de Español reciben bonos especiales, y decidí probar suerte. Al principio perdí varias veces, pero luego aumenté la apuesta en la ruleta y gané una cantidad impresionante. Fue una sensación increíble ver cómo todo cambiaba tan rápido. Lo recomiendo totalmente, pero siempre con responsabilidad.
Als Gelegenheitsspieler in der Schweiz habe ich win airline ausprobiert. Die Plattform ist modern, übersichtlich und bietet viele Slots sowie klassische Casinospiele. Besonders gut gefallen mir die fairen Bonusaktionen und die schnelle Abwicklung der Zahlungen. Auch der Support ist freundlich und hilfsbereit. Ich spiele hier regelmäßig, weil alles transparent und stabil funktioniert und die mobile Version hervorragend läuft.